Brad Wardell's views about technology, politics, religion, world affairs, and all sorts of politically incorrect topics.
What we've been working on..
Published on March 24, 2006 By Draginol In GalCiv Journals
V1.1 BETA Change-Log (March 24, 2006)
 
+ New Option: No tech Trading. Players can prevent any tech trading by anyone.

+ New Option: Blind Exploration. Players can now start out not knowing where the other civilizations are located.

+ New Option: Disable Minor races. No minor races.

+ New Option: Randomize player intelligence. This will scramble opponent intelligence by around +/- 10 points to have more variance.

+ New Option: Randomly pick opponents. Players can simply choose to play against N opponents and it will pick them out.

+ Ship Design Screen re-designed to allow far more visible space for designing.

+ Ship Design Screen supports panning with left-mouse button held down.

+ Ship Design Screen displays installed components in a grid list. Right click to remove a component.

+ Ship Design Screen supports rotation of components.  See options screen to control how much you can rotate them.

+ Ship Design Screen supports copy/pasting behavior with ship size/rotation. If you select an existing component and then select a new component, the new component will automatically take on the size and rotation of the installed component you had just selected.

+ Ship Design Screen supports symmetry in rotation. Select an existing component, then select a new component to add on and then RIGHT-CLICK on the appropriate rotation dial and it will mirror the rotation automatically.

+ Ship level doesn't add as much to max HP.

+ Option now to display an animated dotted line showing where your selected ship is going.

+ How many turns it will take to reach a destination can be displayed at the destination target for selected ship. Note that you can hold down the Shift key and drag select multiple units.

+ If low-level espionage achieved, you can see the destination of selected enemy ships.

+ AI values range technologies more

+ Sensor techs increase sensor ability

+ Lots of little AI tweaks not worth mentioning but together will make a substantial difference to making the AI more enjoyable at low levels and more challenging at higher levels.

+ AI's more aggressive about expanding range with starbases. (some of  them anyway)

+ Uncommon habitable planets tweaked to make them slightly more likely to have habitable planets.

+ Fixed AI bug where it would sometimes put its rally points on planets when it didn't mean to.

+ AI takes distance more into account than it used to for determining relations.

+ AI more sensitive to cultural and military build up using new APIs that do fewer false positives.

+ AI gives more effort towards researching propulsion technologies.

+ AI puts more effort into logistics techs.

+ AI puts more effort into miniaturization techs. In all 3 cases it does  an evaluation of the galaxy state to determine whether it should be doing this.

+ Some AI personalities focus on significantly different techs.

+ AI will design faster or longer range ships depending on its needs

+ AI tech trading rewritten so that it doesn't do sweetheart deals. Tech trading somewhat rarer now as a practical matter. May need to be balanced so that human player doesn't get too much of an advantage.

+ AI can upgrade ships if it has enough money and thinks it's worth it.

+ AI manages colony improvements more effectively.

+ AI adapts economic strategy based on whether the new "disable tech trading" option is on.

+ AI generally better at picking techs based on new algorithm for evaluating galactic state.

+ Some AIs smarter about building constructors/freighters/defense.

+ Terran Alliance AI will not allow it to fall behind militarily beyond all hope.

+ Most AIs now will try to upgrade existing starbases more so than building new ones.

+ Most AIs will tend not to upgrade starbases that exist just to extend range.

+ Terran Alliance AI builds helper starbases closer to home.

+ Terran Alliance experimental strategy: Very focuses research - will  ignore other weapons techs other than its main strategy. If you're not playing against the humans, you're missing out.

+ Terran Alliance has a whole new ship design sub-module for having its very own types of ships.

+ Terran Alliance will build defenders with no weapons (not needed to keep invaders out).

+ Drengin AI planetary management substantially different from others.

+ AIs take into account wasted social production (which is no longer wasted) into account when deciding what to build.

+ Drengin more likely to escort transports.

+ Drengin will focus more on trying to have the strongest military at all times.

+ Terran Alliance focuses on diplomacy techs, gifting, etc. to keep relations up so that it can pursue technology.

+ Drengin and Terran AIs now very much focused on controlling all nearby galactic resources.

+ Drengin focus more on extending their range of their ships and getting more morale building techs than previously.

+ Drengin tend to focus more on their primary weapon and defense techs. We'll see how it works.

+ Drengin AI a LOT smarter about what they research.

+ Yor AI now derivative of new Drengin AI.

+ AI, in general, values research more than it did previously.

+ First attempt, but probably not last, for AI to try to take out resource starbases of enemies where it can find them (as a reminder to players, the AI doesn't necessarily know the existence of a resource starbase, it has to "see" them. So if you have some resource in the corner of the galaxy, don't wonder why it's not getting attacked any more than why you don't see their resource starbases tucked into some corner).

+ Trade revenue increased on larger galaxies, decreased on smaller galaxies.

+ Starbase factories improve the production of factories and labs on planets by X%. Half of that increased bonus is "free" and the other half is charged for.

+ The -2000 ceiling on debt has been eliminated for players playing at higher difficulty levels.

+ Last vestiges of aborted feature "Propaganda" eliminated. Expansion pack will have "agents" that players and AI can assign to do mischief and counter-mischief instead.

+ ECONONOMIC ENGINE CLEANED UP! Production and research now works as follows: Labs and Factories produce N production of their kind. How much of their capacity is used is based on the domestic policy sliders (spend rate X what % on each of the 3 sliders is used).

That amount is then multiplied by 3 types of bonuses:

(1) Your Civ Ability (which you set at start and can enhance by mining special resources).

(2) Economic starbases with factories on them.

(3) Planetary bonuses that comes from random events, UP issues, etc.

50% of this bonus you get for free -- not charged for it. The other half you pay for out of your treasury.

Example: If I have factories producing 100 units and my spend rate is 50% from domestic policy and my military spending is set to 100% then that factory's base production is 50 (50% of 100).

If my Civilization ability on military production is 10% and I have an economic starbase doing 5% bonus and I had an event that increase planet production by 5% then I would have 50 + 20% bonus = 60 production. I would only be charged 55 however -- 10 bonus production, 5 free, 5 paid for.

+ Tax rate angers citizens less (a bit).

+ Your Morale ability is taken to the .90 power and then added to morale (was .80 power).

+ Population growth fixed dramatically. This is going to have a significant game play result that we're still having to fix in the AI. Before, on a class 10 planet with a morale of 70 your population would increase at 20% per turn. Now is would change at 3%.

The "population growth ability bug" wasn't a bug but rather a problem with having populations in billions rather than millions. The population growth was previously capped at 200 million per turn. 20% of say 1 billion (or
higher) reached that cap. So all those bonuses meant nothing.

Now, at 3%, if you have a population of 1 billion then you're looking at an increase of 30 million per turn X your population bonus. If your morale is 100%, that gets doubled again.

Here's the thing: If you drain a population down to only a few billion, it'll take you a very long time to recover. Say goodbye to mass colony rush. You'll need to be very careful or else you could end up with a vast empire of tiny populations producing no money while smaller empires grow beyond you and conquer your weak but large empire.

Population Growth = CurrentMorale X Government Level X PlanetQuality Factory X GrowthFactor.

+ If your morale is > 75% you now get a 25% extra bonus to population growth. If it's at 100% you get a 100% extra bonus.

+ Population growth ability taken into account at the very end of this process for maximium effect.

+ Research Ability used wholesale (previously it was chopped in half).

+ Base taxes collected now is the square root of the population of a planet. This may be tweaked based on play testing.

+ New clean APIs: CalcTotalMilitaryProduction() and social and research equivs that just give you how much a planet is producing (for AI use later).

+ Social Production that is not being used anymore is transferred to military. So you're no longer being charged for social production. However, only the BASE social production is transferred and that amount is not subject to bonuses and so forth (lest there be a lot of cheese tactics and gaming of the social production bonus). So you still need to manage your economy decently but you're no longer being charged for production you're not using.

+ AI at lower levels gets less money to account for improvements in overall AI.

+ AI now "adds noise" to its decisions based on difficulty level.

Essentially, on things that are prioritized, AI that is playing as a "dumb"
level will have injected into its calculations a noise factor that will result in it coming to wrong conclusions about what it should do and hence do stupid things. It's random

+ Planets on the verge of defecting are more likely to defect.

+ AI updated to use its points differently based on new ability costs.

+ AI Ship design looks at the galaxy size and then decides based on that whether it needs to focus on range or speed more. Before it was one size fits all.

+ Cost to upgrade ships now cheaper.

+ Lockup fix: AI could get confused on where to put a starbase and get into an endless loop.

+ Player and AI on same starbase rules: 4 friendly starbases per sector.

+ AI more likely to target starbases.

+ New function: FindClosestEnemyStarbase()

+ AI will send its ships to guard nearby planets rather than cluster them in hordes.

+ AI will target military support starbases more so.

+ Bonus production now displayed in various displays).

+ Updates to the various screens to display the correct economic data based on the new economic engine (involved 9 different .cpp files).

+ Planet Abilities decreased in player start-up. Before someone yells (or if someone can answer them on various forums): Before the abilities would then get nerfed in game. For instance, a research ability of 20 was treated as a 10 when calculated. Now, the research ability is half as much in the player setup window but multiplied directly. There's no net change, it's just a display change.

+ Message changed to tell players they can only build 4 friendly starbases in a given sector.

+ Most defense modules are now slightly smaller

+ Logistics change: Large ships now use 6 logistics (was 5). Huge ships use 8 (was 6).

+ HP change: Large ships get 30HP base (was 28).

+ HP change: Huge ships get 50HP base (was 48).

+ Nano Rippper damage changed from 8 to 6.

+ Capitals no longer provide a morale bonus.

+ Maintenance on labs and factories increased slightly (1 to 2) to compensate for higher tax income and easier morale.

+ Factories and labs produce slightly less base production (because the new bonus system provides more bonus production).

+ Cost of some high level buildings substantially decreased.

+ Slight tweaks to racial abilities.

+ Eliminated Galactic Mall and Concert Hall starbase modules. Since influence victory strategies have been strengthened, we require players to have to go for the cultural domination tech path.

+ Put cost to upgrade an influence starbase at the beginning, subsequent modules are free.

+ Mining modules have been significantly nerfed since abilities are now directly multiplied rather than modified.

+ If you have the cultural domination techs, you can build directly to  those upper cultural influence modules bypassing the wimpier lower level ones.

+ Influence modules are less powerful (since you can now go directly to them) but still very powerful.

+ Fixed some tech tree bugs where the category was wrong. The AI relies on category to determine what type of tech it is since the AI isn't scripted.

+ Lots of tweaks to technology costs based on play testing and user feedback.

+ AI values tweaked. Miniaturization was valued very low. So the AI tended to have lots of cheap and ineffective ships compared to expert players.

+ AI less aggressive at lower levels.

+ Fixed typo in UP issue.

+ Prevent Cheese: Do not allow player to open fleet manager for a ship that is fighting. They could disband or change the ships in the fleet.
 
+ If a component on the ship is selected, size and rotation will remain the same as the selected component when a new component is chosen

+ You can click a slot at the top of the window to select a component on the ship. Clicking the slot again, de-selects the component.

+ Clicking a component on the ship, high-lights its slot in the component list

+ Fixed bug where if you choose a filter, and then add a component that should be filtered out, it would still show in the list

+ Size and rotation settings are no longer reset when selecting a new component type

+ Fixed bug where Clear button did not restore modules ( like colony, trade, etc) in the list of available components if they had been added to the ship before clearing it.

+ Fixed an exploit where players could add several modules of different types on the same ship by using auto-place.

+ Fixed not being able to select slots Slots now tint to the correct color

+ Took out the old component "slots" code and replaced it with new code using a grid list control.

+ Implemented the filter controls for choosing function or structural parts, or all parts. Known bug: if you choose a filter then add a component of diff type it will show in the list.

+ Added support for mouse wheel to the rotation dials. They will use whatever increment you have set in the options screen for rotations.

+ Made the constructor highlight slightly less transparent to make it more visible

+ Random ?'s turn on and off on the Opponent screen Polished

+ Functionality on the Opponent Screen added funciton to

+ "OverrideTextDisplay" of Spinners

+ added code to make civ save extra research points when it has more needs for the current tech

+ changed code to save ship designs as .xml files blind exploration now works

+ Changed "Enable Minor Races" option to "Disable Minor Races"

+ Changing any of the Game Options in Galaxy setup will now trigger the galaxy thread to be recreated if it is already running

+ Random Number of Races option working

+ Random Selection of Races option working (PaulB will be cheking in a screen to fix the clipping)

+ Random Intel option working (PaulB will be cheking in a screen to fix the clipping)

+ Added Stat in "Foreign Stats">"Misc" that gives the intelligence of the race.

+ NEW FEATURE: Auto-Pilot Lines checked in NEW FEATURE: "Show Auto Pilot

+ Lines" option added to Options screen NEW FEATURE: Resource icons on

+ tactical map are now color-coded NEW FEATURE: Number of weeks to move

+ to destination appears on the destination cursor

+ Tweak: Made dial needles thinner in ship designer

+ Fix: Bug where adding a ship with moves to a fleet with 0 moves restores the fleet's moves

+ Fix: Potential crash in overlay code

+ Fix: Made constructor highlights slightly more visible

+ Fix: Fleet Manager updates context area if fleet is disbanded

+ Fix: Removed code in CalcAStarRoute (used by trade routes and auto-pilot lines) that prevented the route from reaching across a gigantic galaxy

+ added code to FindPath to allow AI ships to get a new destination when they don't have one

+ added code to CanRaceBuildShip to check for an existing model file if  it's a user defined ship

+ added code to classShipTypes to save out an XML file for its def. If a ship is user defined and this function can't find a .shipcfg file for it, it will now return FALSE. This fixes the bug that Brad found where he was playing as a custom race and he changed what style of ship he was using.

+Fixed length of the Zombie Army event to make it fit nicer in the box

+Added ability to pan and rotate main map with the Keyboard:
   -CTRL and Arrow keys to rotate (with snapback working if activated)
   -SHIFT and Arrowkeys to pan main map

+ Old "hardpoint modifiers" that rotated and flipped hardpoints have been marked as "hidden." This removes them from the components the players can choose, and also allows them to keep using the designs they have previously made that use them.

+ Improvement Summary window now shows tile improvements and their effects on the improvement and planet

+ Fixed bug where obsoleting a ship that had been purchased prevents the star port that purchased it from ever building anything else again

+ Improvement Summary Window: Fixed spacing of units

+ removed some references to humanity in the Tech Tree (but only where it made sense to remove, most places it worked well)

+ Fleet Manager: Now displays number representing ship's logistic value in ship thumbnail

+ Fleet Manager: Implemented the command buttons

+ Ship Designer: Implemented "Reset Component" button

+ Ship Designer: Added tool-tips to the new design UI controls

+ Ship Designer: Fix: Scaling selected part now scales ONLY that part

+ Fleet Manager window is implemented

+ Dbl-click a fleet or click on Details in the fleet context window to open it.  Use it to add ships to your fleet. Use it to move ships from one fleet to another. It still needs a few graphical tweaks: Some things don't tint Will be adding a number next to the ship icons to show their logistics (like the stacked ships window does)
 

+ You can no longer multi-select dead ships or ships hidden by FOW (This fixes bug where multi-select highlights empty spaces)

+ You can not cycle through fleets in the ship details window anymore (This is to make way for the new Fleet Manager screen)

+ Action buttons in ship details screen are now disabled if the ship cannot perform that action

+ Fixed bug where text in trade screen would display green when using the money slider even if the AI would refuse to trade a military tech because the civ was too powerful.

+ Fixed bug that Brad e-mailed about (Planet logos missing when zoomed out)

+ Fixed bug in Tutorials window where pressing ESC key would hang the game

+ Fixed UP Starbase Tax law-related problems.

+ Fixed bug where a player could not attack Dread Lord planet with an orbital fleet manager on it

+ Fixed non-working scroll bar in rally point window Added GetTurnsAway  function to classStarShip that returns a float indicating number of turns it will take to get to specified tile CTRL+I now displays the number of turns it will take a ship to get to its destination.

+ MiraclePlanets Event: Now updates the overlay icons for the planets. (They used to have "uninhabitable" icons even though they were upgraded by the event)

+ Fixed exploit where you could get around UP starbase module limit using a fleet of constructors

+ Fixed sizing to 0 error message in debug.err in ShipCombatShipsEntryWnd.

+ AIUpgradeShip will not allow you to use it on a fleet (it will abort gracefully) “Fleets” themselves cannot be upgraded, but the ships in them can

+ Fixed UP Law bug where starfaring tax was applied even if the civ in question was dead

+ Fixed UP Law bug where war tax was applied even if the civ you were at war with was dead

+ Fixed UP Law bug where Starbase tax was applied even on starbases that were destroyed

+ Changed starship::GetFleet function to return a pointer to itself if the ship is a fleet.

+ Found and fixed source of “Influence Flooding” bug.  If the invader used the “Use unhappy citizens” tactic, these citizens could be counted as casualties and the casualties would exceed the number of troops on the transports, thus giving a negative population.

+ Fixed crash when memory allocation fails on ship type creation in ship designer. Adds message to debug.err when this happens and takes appropriate action to avoid crash

+ Fixed crash in Polyline.  It now checks number of points in the line to avoid out of bounds crash.

+ Fixed CTD on Governor Screen.   pColony was not set in governor mini map. Pointer is checked now.

+ Fixed bug where removing components does not remove their tech requirement.

+ Fixed crash when entering victory status screen.  Planet was not set in colony::CalcMorale.

+ Fixed incorrect stat shown in ship statistics text (Trade screen)

+ Fixed bug where data on main screen (treasury, tech, etc) would not update immediately after loading a saved game

+ Fixed crash in OverlayGraphic::QueryInterface function.  Pointer was not being checked.

+ Trade Screen, if you right-click a ship, you will now get the “ship intelligence report” on that specific ship, instead of a generalized ship type information popup.

+ Trade Screen, if you right-click a starbase, it will now show the correct data based on what modules your starbase has.

+ Fixed a typo in conversations

+ Fixed a “false positive” message in debug.err.  It would display “Could not find texture” when PictureFrame images were being set to NULL (to clear the image).  This is ok.

+ If population after an invasion is less than 1, it will be set to 1

+ Fixed incorrect data being displayed in Ship Upgrade window

+ Fixed colors in a few end game summary screens to use race color instead of interface color

More to come...


Comments (Page 10)
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on Mar 31, 2006
Hmmm, I'm not sure that there is a randomness that is involved in the current model, since from what I can gather, it seems like Brad is putting in these values through testing (the randomization is really only because of diplomacy abilities). If what you mean is that the AIs should value certain technologies differently, then I agree with your point, what I meant in that particular section, and I admit it wasn't worded very well, was that perhaps it should scale somewhat based on the number of players as well. Since, in my example, while the sell for twice, buy for half model works well in the favor of the player when there is 12 players, if you reduce the number to 4 for a tiny galaxy, the player really doesn't gain much benefit for going through that trouble. I suppose it does take a lot less work to pull off, but wouldn't this make it more useful for players to play with as large of a galaxy or as many players as they can, so that they can gain the initial tech whoring benefits more? (Since initial tech whoring is usually the most important.)

For example, I have nothing against the Altarians wanting more logistics because, let's face it, they start with a disadvantage in that field, so let's put that as a base value of 2x cost (arbitrary value for explanation purposes), and then modify that value by .1 for every 2 players less than 10 downwards, and upwards for every player above 10. So that if you have 12 players left in the game, the Altarians would value it as 2.1 x cost, while at 4 players left, they would value it as 1.7 x cost. This is just an example though, I hope you understood what I meant... I'm sure it could be done more simply starting from the lowest number of players remaining 1 and working upwards. Essentially, it would be like how most ship components have a size and a scaling variable, that determines the final size based upon the total space on your ship.

Hopefully that clarified my thoughts regarding that matter. Then again, maybe I'm the one not understanding your post...
on Apr 01, 2006
So if you wasted 100BC on that technology, and sold it to all the other races for 1100BC, you just made 1000BC for free at his expense, since he would have made that money if he traded it away. Hence, the reason why you can beat an AI silly even while giving it a 200% economy bonus. This is why there was such a huge outcry for the "no tech trading" option.
Taking features out of a game is an awful solution though. Making the AI play more like a person is what everyone should have been asking for.

on Apr 02, 2006
Taking features out of a game is an awful solution though. Making the AI play more like a person is what everyone should have been asking for.


I suppose that that is really what I am trying to say. I'm glad not all of us are as poor comunicators as me.
on Apr 02, 2006
If you both mean the no-tech trading option, then I agree that taking out tech trading completely is not a great idea, that was why a reworking of the trading system itself was needed (and why I supported the changes to trading in the first place). With the new system in 1.1, you could still trade techs and even whore it out if you want, but it isn't so powerful in favor of the player that it has to be taken out completely just to be fair for the AI. Even if that meant that the AI had to start asking for more for each individual deals (and not looking 'fair' in doing so).

I guess I'm not such a great communicator either, lol... oh wells.
on Apr 02, 2006
I just played a Huge, Slow Tech, Suicidal game just to see what it was like in this Beta. Within the first year the Computer AI's had over 100 Colonies. Most of them with Populations below 50 Million. I have seen 5 and 15 Million Population planets. Can you make limit on Colony ships to at least 100 Million Colonists or else they can't Launch the Colony Ship?
on Apr 03, 2006
Is there a way to tell what the AI level is set to once I am in the game? (Cause I forgot.)
on Apr 04, 2006
Thanks for introducing me to this thread Kalin. As stated elsewhere my views are similar to Martimus'.
I had the chance to read your opposition.
It is a "LITTLE" frustrating being labelled as tech whores. There are varying degrees. What I do, I wouldn't call it that. I don't go and offer every tech to every race in the galaxy.
I want to trade beam defense for missile defense. I think it nuts to throw a lot of cash to get a trade. Even up. No real diplo advantages on either side, both should take it, they are gaining something of equal value.

..er What I am trying to say is I don't agree with you and the fix put in for 'No Trading' screwed it over for those who did trading (responsibly).
on Apr 04, 2006
Oh don't get me wrong, I'm not calling you or anyone 'tech whores', just that specific tech trading strategy (buying tech and then selling it to everyone else for profit). I understand completely that a 'responsible' trader would be upset that it is no longer fair, but the fact that you HAVE to be responsible is the problem. Basically, that's like saying, "oh, the AI is dumb about this, so I can't do that or it won't be any fun." As you can see, that does not, in any way, refers to an "intelligent" AI. Like I said before I have no problem with a lower AI, like the "bright" AI being nicer about it, but the best AI needs this kind of defense against a very viable strategy. Even if it's not considered a strategy, and an exploit, it still needs to be fixed. Leaving it in and asking the players to be responsible just seems a little silly.

Now, is it the perfect fix? Perhaps not, but it is probably the easiest fix available. Buy low, sell high... it makes perfect sense. I mean, this is a game that considers you "friends" because your military looks scary, it wouldn't make sense to give you 'fair' deals so that you become even stronger, and alliances can be easily broken (which is why I mentioned that it would only be fair at the next level, maybe "unity" would sound better). So unless you're extorting them (which works fine), it's okay.

Imagine if you didn't implement that system, you would have to start putting in artificial barriers, like you can only trade once every turn, and you have to wait a few turns to trade that away again, etc... or perhaps that blue-print trading suggestion that has been floating around for quite some time (which changes the game and will require new AI routines to deal with it). All of these requires a lot more work than just tweaking some of the numbers, and I'm not even sure if it would really fix the problem.

Now, the blue-print idea I like, and hopefully that might make it into the game in some later version, but like I said, it would change how the game plays, so it will have to be a new game option and the imediate problem with the core game isn't solved. The artificial barriers I don't like at all simply because it seems odd that the player is being treated "special", sort of like the current military tech barrier that they are trying to gradually phase out.

So when you think about it, the new trading is probably the best option, because it is 1) easiest to implement, 2) fixes the core game, and 3) doesn't limit what the player can do and help keep the vision that the AI is playing under the same rules intact.

on Apr 04, 2006
2 things.

1) its clear to me that the game was shiped before it was finished, and some things that should have been in, just left out, perhaps with an eye to the 'expantion' (IE spying). thats a huge list and id say about 7/10ths of it are in the nature of bug fixes. ................ now that being said on to two

2) im glad, so VERY glad, to say that stardock actualy does FIX this stuff. to many time in the recient past ive purchased games with glaring flaws (starting way back with MOO3 and has gone down hill since with many games published) and outside a few patches that fix the more gaping wounds and totaly ignore the minor annoying 'glitches' that i want to puke. i owned GS 1 and it was the quality of support alone that made me plunk down my worked for cash to buy this version.

i ask you how many times have you purchased a game latley only to find major flaws, or just a hand full of annoying bugs only to be left to 'work around' them. well i dont spend cash to have to 'work around' bad programing or be someones beta tester, only to have a game ultimatly left on my shelf still wating for patch 1.5 that never comes because the company has my cash and is now onto making the next craptastick bit of junk.

i felt compelled to make this post simply because i dont think you can overstress the real value in the support that stardock gives its games. id even go so far as to say that if stardock made a game of a genra that i dont play (such as fps) id BUY that game and let it set on a shelf just to support this company simply because they are the gold standord that all other games companys SHOULD be striving for in THEIR after market support.

we all whine enough when things are wrong. im VERY happy to say that this company gives us all something to praise. the well and truly have put the 'customer' back in CUSTOMER support.

outstanding job
on Apr 04, 2006
I just want to say though, the game was designed with trading techs in mind. Each race is given different techs to begin with. It's also different than whoring. At the start you don't have contacts with all the races, you have to find them or seek them out. You and your nearest neighbor are better off trading because you'll both get something for doing the trade. The next race you meet will likely have different stuff to trade.

I was thinking of things to resolve my frustrations with diplo and came up with some various ideas.

1) Adding symbol for alignment somewhere on each side of screen so you can yours and theirs.
2) Adding an indicator for diplomatic ability, both yours and theirs.
3) Some kind of analysis, 'saying' or somesuch assuring the player that all factors into consideration we may be forced to pay % more for deals. Or due to a number of positive factors we may be able to get things for % less..
4) Slider fix, left-right goes up in increments of 10s and up/down 100.
5) Adding in display of relative military might for both sides
6) For actual tech whoring vs trading.. make the re-sale value less. Diminishing returns on the number of times you sold the same tech.


1 thru 5, is reminder for player to see what can affect diplomacy while you are "doing it".
4 would be my own personal tweak to the sliders for money/ IP
6 Discourages whoring, while first time trades are somewhat fair. Example if theres 10 races to trade with, tech loses 1/10 of value each time a trade is made. Don't feel this is right, can always tweak the number a bit if more discouragement is needed.

I think people like me, who felt jilted at the whole trading/whoring fix already would feel better about trading if can see the factors involving it.

I don't agree with all of the changes, however I do agree with some. As mentioned logistics is more valued and I can understand and agree to that. There's many factors involved and it would be hard to post hypotheticals. IMO miniaturization is more valued also, which I would agree to too. It's other ones that don't make as much sense to me, like trading a buttload of stuff for say xeno banks and maybe I have xeno farms and extreme entertainment as an example (two techs that I think were same value or close to it ) but NO that greedy SOB of an AI wants more. When I really get pissed I say screw it and hit the clear button and decide to research it myself. It'd be cheaper in terms of not giving up that much stuff.

Well I said my part. I feel much better now & even provided some suggestions. Heh. Thanks.



on Apr 04, 2006
This post in regards to post #144

1) I totally disagree with you. Ask any beta tester or gamma tester who tested the game before it was released. They (the gammas at the end) said it was ready and all agreed on it. Stardock held it for another week polishing it even further. Less than 10% is bug fix and the rest is new stuff.

2) Actually agree with this one. The developer commitment is phenomenal. The immersion on the forums (interactions). The journals. Stardock Customer Support should be the model for every game company. I can't think of a finer compliment or I would say it. God bless those wonderful, beautiful people working support.
on Apr 04, 2006
If he thinks this game is buggy and unfinished, he hasn't been playing computer games very long.
on Apr 05, 2006
heh now dont get me wrong. i simply ment that the list is so huge, and most of it is 'tweaking' stuff. my take on it is that tweeking should have been done before it shiped. not so much bugs (though some are) but judging from the list alot of stuff wasnt 'polished' enough before it shiped. i can name about 10 things of the top of my head that are clearly bugs that didnt even make the list. and some of those things on the list are what id call major game changes, granted alot of them were asked for (IE no tech trading) but some of them were clearly just not finished in time for the ship date and are being implimented now. such as all the ship design remake. and the "+ Population growth fixed dramatically. This is going to have a significant game play result that we're still having to fix in the AI. Before, on a class 10 planet with a morale of 70 your population would increase at 20% per turn. Now is would change at 3%." as well as several more.

and furthermore, if you just scan the list check how many start with "fixed a bug". their words not mine.


but my point was too stress that these things get fixed by stardock. and IIRC GS 1 had about the same set of problems. calling a spade a spade doesnt mean im anti anything. the real point to what i said was to make a special note of the fact that this company does actualy fix the stuff in the end. that alone still tickles me to no end. not only do they fix it but they dont claim that a bug is just a 'feature' that we cant understand because its all 'under the hood' like several other games ive played tryed to fob off (stronghold for one). all games have bugs. but not all companys fix them or even admit they are there.

and yes i know of what i speak. ive been playing video games since pong
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