Rush, Instapundit debate II

Bottom line: A Democratic victory would not be the end of the world

Published on October 17, 2006 By Draginol In Republican

Today on Rush Limbaugh's show, Rush referred indirectly to yesterday's article about the Instapundit vs. Rush fallout.

From listening to the show, Rush clearly seems to think that conservatives, such as myself, are being naive or as he put it, should "expand their horizons" on what the repercussions of a Democratic victory in November would be.

Considerable time was spent on the premise that votes shouldn't be used to "teach a lesson". Or more to the point, that a vote really can't be used to teach a lesson. I disagree. You can bet that if the Republicans lose, especially given how loud the right has been about its dissatisaction with Republicans in congress, that they will take it to hear.

The difference is that many conservatives, myself included, don't think the world will end if Democrats gain control of the house (and even the senate). We're not like the hysterical left that thinks if its opponents win that the world will be destroyed.

I don't think we'll see some massive tax increase, I don't think we'll "cut and run" from Iraq, I don't think Bush will be impeached, I don't think we'll lose the war on terrorism. If the Democrats were about to get a big majority of congress, I might feel differently, but at most, the Democrats would have a tiny majority in both houses with a veto-wielding Republican in the white house.

If congressional Democrats start acting like kooks for all the American people to see, they'll suffer in 2008 when the stakes are much higher.

And you can also be sure that congressional Republicans won't soon forget what happens in the age of the "new media" if you piss off your base.

So Rush, spare us the patronizing "we've been brainwashed by the 'drive by' media". It was on-line conservatives that got Trent Lott out after his foolish remarks about Thurmond. It was on-line conservatives that exposed the forged documents on 60-minutes. We don't get our marching orders from the MSM. If anything, the marching orders to the MSM increasingly come from the blogsphere. Sites like Instapundit, JoeUser, and tens of thousands of others who in turn express the opinions of ordinary Americans.

We are unhappy with Republicans. That doesn't mean we'll vote for Democrats out of spite, they have their own constiuencies to deal with. If Republicans lose, it's becauase they didn't earn our vote. And you can bet they will remember that. They will have plenty of statistical research to drive that point home. And the world won't end.

Update: And no, I won't be "glad" if Republicans lose. I just think if they lose, they brought it on themselves..

Update: Yes, I understand there are lots of Democrats who act like kooks. And yet, when the senate was narrowly under Democratic control prior to 2004 it wasn't the end of the world. IF the Democrats win back the house AND IF they pass bills that Republicans don't find acceptable THEN Bush should use his VETO. IF he does not use it, then that speaks to a totally different problem.

Response: Rush discussed this on the show, here is a response.

Comments (Page 5)

Disgusted

on Oct 18, 2006

The last time the Dems took over, it took 40 years to regain the house. I do not think I will be around to see the Republicans back in control, if they lose this time. I fear for how my children and grandchildren will live under socialism. Make no mistake about this. Socialism is what will be. After all, Nancy Pelosi, along with most of the Dems, is a socialist. Many are communist. The rest are just clueless.

Daniel H. Callahan

on Oct 18, 2006

IDIOT

Art

on Oct 18, 2006

The GOP does not deserve to lose. No one deserves to lose. If you do not like what is happening then vote another Conservative in. Get rid of the one that irritates you.
We do not need Tax hikes, more Liberals on the SCOTUS, and a cut and run program in Iraq and Afghanistan. Yes we will see massive tax increases, Clinton taught us that and he made it retroactive. Charles Rangel said it a number of times, he will roll back the tax cuts. That's massive. They will try to Impeach President Bush. Pelosi has stated as much as has Conyers.
We will definitly lose out on the war on terror as the Dems have no battle plan merely one of appeasement.
The GOP is not doomed but you're not helping with a Pre-Mortem which is ridiculous. You bury a body after it dies not before. I read this blog and use it sometimes as a source for my own arguements. Yours, concerning burying the body prior to death, is absurd.
P.S. Rush was not even thinking of you when he made his comments.

Draginol

on Oct 18, 2006

Mr. Purity. Rush really got you on this one. Your position isn't naive - it is idealistic, fantasitc, and unAmerican. It is unAmerican because our system is meant to frustrate all these conservative gimmees you are whining for

Given that it is Rush, not me, that is complaining about Republicans possibly losing control of congress I don't really see how I'm the one frustrated. We're a representative republic. I vote for candidates that I feel will best represent my views. If no candidates are doing that, I don't feel obliged to vote for anyone of them. Millions of other conservatives feel the same way.

Don Williams

on Oct 18, 2006

"It's a damm poor mind that can only think of one way to spell a word" --Andrew Jackson

Draginol

on Oct 18, 2006

Hah. I am finding it highly amusing that Glenn Reynolds, whose writings have appeared in the Wall Street Journal and who posits himself as a highly independent thinker, is now hiding behind James Taranto and some twit blogger who nobody ever heard of (that would be JoeUser) when confronted by Rush Limbaugh about his "pre-mortem" article which, let's all admit, was pretty stupid. The Republicans deserve to lose because of Terri Schiavo and Harriett Miers? For Pete's sake -- everyone in the country (except for Glenn, apparently) has forgotten them. The article was a mistake and demonstrated that Glenn is not really as smart as he would like us all to believe, which is why he is now backpedaling furiously, as any reader of InstaPundit can tell by his recent postings.

As to the spelling issue -- if you want to write in a public forum and be respected, then learn to write well. That includes spelling correctly, or use your spell-check.

For a guy who's handle is a single letter, you certainly are pretty arrogant. I wasn't aware that fame was indicative of correct or not. But let's go with that for a second -- you are even less known than I am therefore why should I or anyone care what you think?

If only myself and Glenn Reynolds felt this way, we wouldn't be having this discussion. The Republicans wouldn't be in trouble and your assertions would make perfect sense. However, unfortunately for you, millions of Americans who are conservative are put off enough by the congressional nonsense that it may affect voter turn out. Incidentally I didn't say I wasn't going to vote, I am saying that I don't automatically hand over my vote to someone simply because they have an (R) badge by them. I, along with millions of others, can choose to withold our vote as well if we feel we're not adquately represented.

(BTW, if you check my real name, you'll find that I actually have appeared in Time Magazine, The Wallstreet Journal, US News and World Report, CNBC, MSNBC, CNN, and elsewhere for whatever that's worth -- which in my view is nothing at all).

Wayne

on Oct 18, 2006

As much as I would like to think that we should punish CERTAIN Republicans for their stupididty, there are others who deserve our whole-hearted support. Centrist buttbiters like John McSwine and Spectre-defectre out to be tossed out on their traitorous stinking useless lying butts.

BUT, we are looking at Supreme Court changes, tax code issues, AND A WAR (for GOd's sake!!) to deal with in the next couple of years and we can not afford to have that commie concubine PelHOsi, killer Kennedy, and Charlie "so-called terrorists" Rangel to have shot at truly screwing this country up.

We have a shot at ending abortion. We might get to fix Social Security. Most importantly the REPUBLICANS in the house have done a little bit about the border andWe have a shot at actually winning against Islamists and Fascists but we have to act quickly and if Bush is spending his time answering subpeona's and being impeached we not only won't get anything done and opportunites will be lost, but what other country, whether ally or enemy, is going to do anything that we ask or try to force them to do because an impotent Bush (or Cheney or even God forbid President Pelosi!!) say so.

Greg D

on Oct 18, 2006

I don't think we'll see some massive tax increase

Some of the Bush tax cuts will expire if the Democrats get control in 2006. Any tax increase is too much, IMHO.

I don't think we'll "cut and run" from Iraq

You don't think the Democrats will vote to cut funding? You expect Bush to spark a Constitutional Crisis by ignoring them?

I don't think Bush will be impeached

It only takes a majority of 1 in the House to Impeach a President (it takes 2/3 in the Senate to remove him). The Democrats have been voting in lockstep for the last 6 years, what makes you think that will change if they win?

I don't think we'll lose the war on terrorism

Lose the "war"? No. Lose battles, battles that would have been won if we had a Congress that wanted victory?

Yes.

How many battles are you willing to lose in order to hopefully "teach the Republicans a lesson"?

If congressional Democrats start acting like kooks for all the American people to see, they'll suffer in 2008 when the stakes are much higher.

The Stakes are already high, and they consistently act like kooks now. What realistically makes you think that will change?

You want the Republicans to learn something? Great! Do what I'm going to do: Join the 72 hour effort to get out votes for a Republican you support. While doing that, and afterwards (esp. if he / she wins) amke the point that this is the last time you're going to do that unless the Republicans get back to acting like real Republicans.

That's making your voice matter.

If your local Republicans suck, don't work for them. If you can't find a single national Republican in "trouble" who you want to win, then you're not really a Republican, and all this is a pointless waste.

Greg D

on Oct 18, 2006

Let's try this again:

I don't think we'll see some massive tax increase

Some of the Bush tax cuts will expire if the Democrats get control in 2006. Any tax increase is too much, IMHO.

I don't think we'll "cut and run" from Iraq

You don't think the Democrats will vote to cut funding? You expect Bush to spark a Constitutional Crisis by ignoring them?

I don't think Bush will be impeached

It only takes a majority of 1 in the House to Impeach a President (it takes 2/3 in the Senate to remove him). The Democrats have been voting in lockstep for the last 6 years, what makes you think that will change if they win?

I don't think we'll lose the war on terrorism

Lose the "war"? No. Lose battles, battles that would have been won if we had a Congress that wanted victory?

Yes.

How many battles are you willing to lose in order to hopefully "teach the Republicans a lesson"?

If congressional Democrats start acting like kooks for all the American people to see, they'll suffer in 2008 when the stakes are much higher.

The stakes are already high, and they consistently act like kooks now. What realistically makes you think that will change?

You want the Republicans to learn something? Great! Do what I'm going to do: Join the 72 hour effort to get out votes for a Republican you support. While doing that, and afterwards (esp. if he / she wins) amke the point that this is the last time you're going to do that unless the Republicans get back to acting like real Republicans.

That's making your voice matter.

If your local Republicans suck, don't work for them. If you can't find a single national Republican in "trouble" who you want to win, then you're not really a Republican, and all this is a pointless waste.

Willing to bet money on that? You think a slight Democratic majority will result in nationalized health care, tax hikes, and a couple of left wing supreme court justices?

If losing a tax cut counts as a tax hike (I think it does), then slight Democratic majority will result in tax hikes, an illegal immigrant amnesty, and blocking of all good Supreme Court and Appeals Court judges appointed in the next two years.

I'll put money on that. Would you bet money against that? How much do you want to lose?

Greg D

on Oct 18, 2006

Ok, I give, how DO you mark off quoted text from other text?

Dr Guy

on Oct 18, 2006

Ok, I give, how DO you mark off quoted text from other text?

With the tags [ quote ] and [ /quote ] (without the spaces of course).

Draginol

on Oct 18, 2006

Greg D: You are entitled to your opinon. I am entitled to m ine.

I also didn't claim to be a Republican. I clamed to be a conservative.

If the stakes are truly so high, which, as I said, I don't think they are but you are entitled to your view, then congressional Republicans should be more effective at making that case.

Someone said earlier that look what happened in 1992 when conservatives, unhappy with Bush, stayed home. Yea, the result was 2 years later conservatives took control of Congress and we had a balanced budget within a few years after that and the end of welfare as we know it.

drmiler

on Oct 18, 2006

I don't think we'll "cut and run" from Iraq

I don't think Bush will be impeached

Major Democrats have already stated they will do both if they can gain control.

Kaymad

on Oct 18, 2006

"It was on-line conservatives that got Trent Lott out after his foolish remarks about Thurmond". This sentence made me laugh out loud. Bloggers can get rid of conservatives. Yeah Bloggers! What power! Get rid of a Democrat now and than, than I'll be impressed. I'll be breathlessly watching at what you inflict on Harry Reid. What? You say he isn't gone yet? He hasn't even reached page A10 of most newspapers?? Where is that power Bloggers wield?

Brad Wardell

on Oct 18, 2006

And Major Democrats have already stated a lot of other things. Doesn't mean it'll happen.

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