Brad Wardell's views about technology, politics, religion, world affairs, and all sorts of politically incorrect topics.
Published on July 11, 2009 By Draginol In Politics

In no particular order…

Scientists are Democrats…right?

Pew Research says that 55% of scientists say they are Democrats, 6% Republicans. Gosh, must mean people who value the scientific method are Democrats while Republicans are just a bunch of religious nut jobs right?

Strangely, the left-wingers who have commented on it don’t seem to be that concerned as to how the survey identified who a “scientist” was.  Is a scientist someone who works at a university doing pure scientific research on the breeding patterns of fruit flies? Does it count someone who works at say a software company researching new ways to simulate different uses of carbon nanotubes?  Something tells me the survey identified the former as a scientist and the latter was not counted as one.  Icky capitalists aren’t scientists right?

Would people who want “affordable” health insurance be willing to go to your door with hat and hand?

I was reading Digg the other day and as some of you know, Digg is largely populated by far left-wing people who are largely unaware of how far left they are (they freak out about FOX News pretty much daily). 

Anyway, on the topic of health care, every time there is a discussion on it, it always boils down to the consensus (on Digg anyway) that single player health care is the way to go.  Single player meaning really tax payers which, as some know, is only around 60% of the US population, the other 40% paying zilch.

So let’s put this in perspective.  Presently, around 88% of the adult population of the United States has health insurance that they either pay for themselves or (mostly) is paid for by their employer. No matter how you slice it, they’re “paying into” the system.

But single payer advocates prefer a system in which only 60% of the population is paying into it.  This means either massively higher taxes just to get what we have today OR (more likely) a lot crappier quality health care than we have today and all so that the remaining 12% of the population can have health insurance.

Most people I’ve met who want a single payer system happen to be in that 40% of the population who pay no net federal income taxes.  I wonder if they’d be willing to come hat in hand and ask you to pay for their pills in person? Of course not, they’d rather act like they’re taking the moral high ground in demanding that you pay for their pills via taxes.

Tree huggers & agendas

I don’t expect a lot of out activist environmentalists.  Most activists seem more concerned with making themselves feel like they “care” than actually doing anything constructive to help the planet. It’s purely about emotional satisfaction for them.

In the mind of the modern American liberal, results are irrelevant, it’s about caring. Don’t you care about the environment? Don’t you care about the poor? Don’t you care about…?

I wish they’d do a little less “Caring” and a little more “DOing”.

Case in point, in an on-line debate on whether SUVs should be outlawed or not I pointed out that yes, I drive an SUV to work every day. It only gets 18 MPG. 

The lady debating me in the post took the high and mighty position that it’s people like me destroying the environment because I don’t “care” about the environment.

I pointed out “Well, I only drive 6 miles a day, that means I only burn 1 gallon of gas every 3 days, how far do you drive?”

Well, she has a 2007 Honda Civic Hybrid. She kept pointing this out throughout the discussion because it apparently gets 40MPG.

After a few times of me asking how much she drives, she admitted she works “about” 30 miles from work.  That means 60 miles a day or a gallon and a half of gas PER DAY.

So when I suggested that if she’s so worried about the environment and wants the government to start banning things, why not limit the # of gallons of gas someone can use per week instead of worrying about what kind of car they drive.

And so I got the usual “Not everyone has the luxury of living only a few miles from work, I can’t afford to live any closer.”

Awww. See, it doesn’t matter that she’s burning about 8 gallons a week of gas because she cares. It’s not really about saving the planet. It’s about feeling better about oneself.

I mean, if CO2 is going to cause “millions” of deaths and is the most important issue facing the world (as she repeatedly said) then how can she possibly justify burning 8 gallons of gas a week? Especially when she’s saying “deniers” like me need to give up our “toys” (said toy that burns a quarter as much gas a week as she does).

That’s always been the bottom line with the activist environmental movement. They’re not really serious. It’s just narcissism posing as political posturing.


Comments (Page 4)
7 PagesFirst 2 3 4 5 6  Last
on Jul 16, 2009

That whole principle relies on your right assumption about what treehuggers are like, what they think and what they do.

Of course.

But when I decide to cross the street when no car is coming as opposed to when a car is coming, the whole principle relies on my right assumption about how dangerous it is to be hit by a car vs how dangerous it is not to be hit by a car.

 

on Jul 16, 2009

That's not the same: One is an assumption you make of what you percieve (treehuggers are like that) and the other is taught and learned behaviour or good judgement/common sense of a situation.

There is a big semantic difference between knowing the danger of traffic and assuming that all treehuggers are alike and that you KNOW what they are like. Do you know every single activist personally - if you don't then generalizing everyone could be prejudicial and place people in your percieved group that don't think the way you assume they do.

Knowledge and assumption is not the same.

on Jul 16, 2009

That's not the same: One is an assumption you make of what you percieve (treehuggers are like that) and the other is taught and learned behaviour or good judgement/common sense of a situation.

Both are learned behaviours, good judgment and common sense.

 

There is a big semantic difference between knowing the danger of traffic and assuming that all treehuggers are alike and that you KNOW what they are like. Do you know every single activist personally - if you don't then generalizing everyone could be prejudicial and place people in your percieved group that don't think the way you assume they do.

I haven't been hit by every car, but I assume that they all pretty much are to be avoided anyway based on their common features.

 

Knowledge and assumption is not the same.

No.

I have knowledge of some treehuggers and one car.

And I assume that all treehuggers and all cars are the same as the ones I know.

 

on Jul 16, 2009

This whole debate is abot equality.  You are not allowed to make assumptions that generalize if you respect equality. Different oppinions and skills and ideals cannot lead to you treating certain people differently. (I can see where that would be problematic, but this is a fundamental fact about equality which is rooted in human dignity (Würde).

Stereotypes and making assumptions are the epitome of not regarding different oppinions or people as equal, you don't even recognize individuals because you "know" what they are all about already. I'm sorry, that is arrogant and morally questionable.

on Jul 16, 2009



This whole debate is abot equality.  You are not allowed to make assumptions that generalize if you respect equality. Different opinions and skills and ideals cannot lead to you treating certain people differently.



I don't believe in "equality" as you define it.

For me different opinions and skills and ideals are fundamental to how I should treat people. For me people are equal as people, but not as people who did things. Once an individual says or does something, he loses his inherent equality and he becomes better or worse than others.




(I can see where that would be problematic, but this is a fundamental fact about equality which is rooted in human dignity (Würde).



No, respect for what people say and do is rooted in human dignity. And that means treating people better or wose depending on what they do and say.

A stupid person has a right to be treated like a moron if he decided to be one.




Stereotypes and making assumptions are the epitome of not regarding different oppinions or people as equal, you don't even recognize individuals because you "know" what they are all about already. I'm sorry, that is arrogant and morally questionable.



A treehugger who doesn't want me to think of him as a treehugger shouldn't be a treehugger.

on Jul 16, 2009

You are as thick as brick on this issue.. equal treatment, human dignity and human rights can never be based on what YOU think of an individual.

For me different opinions and skills and ideals are fundamental to how I should treat people. For me people are equal as people, but not as people who did things. Once an individual says or does something, he loses his inherent equality and he becomes better or worse than others.
Basically just after birth then? After that, what you do and what you think determines how you get treated? Are you listening to yourself?!?

respect for what people say and do is rooted in human dignity. And that means treating people better or wose depending on what they do and say.

No and no. Otherwise it would be OK to torture suspects or terrorists or basically anybody you think deserves it. Human dignity is a value in itself, and the way you understand it opens the way to racism, bigotery and prejudicial behaviour because you base everything on YOUR evaluation of what people do and say. It does not work that way. What about disabled people, infants etc. who do all kind of strange things sometimes or who are just unable to live on their own? 

You got a really twisted idea about all of this, and its not a good one.

on Jul 16, 2009

You are as thick as brick on this issue.. equal treatment, human dignity and human rights can never be based on what YOU think of an individual.

How do you do it?

And why do we put some people in prison? Why do we pay some people more money? Why do I pay more for a good book than I would do for a book made of empty pages?

Do we not all treat other people according to our opinions of what they did and said?

 

Basically just after birth then? After that, what you do and what you think determines how you get treated? Are you listening to yourself?!?

I sure hope that's the case. I wouldn't want to be treated like a baby after I learned how to talk and use a toilet. I also wouldn't want a baby to be treated like an adult who can feed himself.

 

No and no. Otherwise it would be OK to torture suspects or terrorists or basically anybody you think deserves it.

Where are you getting that? I didn't say anything about how we should treat other people, just that we should not treat them all the same.

Do we not treat terrorists differently from other people? Why the heck do we put them in prisons if it is wrong to treat them unequally?

 

Human dignity is a value in itself, and the way you understand it opens the way to racism, bigotery and prejudicial behaviour because you base everything on YOUR evaluation of what people do and say.

There is this racism again. How the heck can treating people depending on what they say and do cause racism? It's impossible. Race doesn't come into it. Race doesn't change what an individual says or does.

Do you believe that one's race influences one's behaviour? I thought we, humanity, abandoned that "theory". It was very popular in the late 19th century. And it doesn't lead to good things.

 

It does not work that way. What about disabled people, infants etc. who do all kind of strange things sometimes or who are just unable to live on their own? 

Good example.

Would you treat the disabled equally or differently?

If someone is born disabled, my philosophy says that we have to treat them the same as anybody else, since they haven't done or said anything different, and as I said, my idea is that we should treat people differently based on those things and nothing else.

If they are unable to live on their own, we could and should help them. But that has nothing to do with their value as people. I wish that we do not help them because they are worth more than others or because they are worth less than others, because being handicapped doesn't change a person's value (only what a person says or does changes his value).

Infants should obviously be treated differently, which is fine with my philosophy which dictates that we should treat people according to what they say and do. Infants are OK, aren't they? So what's the problem here?

 

You got a really twisted idea about all of this, and its not a good one.

Careful now. You are treating me according to what I said.

According to my philosophy that is great, but according to yours it could be a problem.

You won't find me, I hope, treating people differently because of what they are. But, like you, I treat them differently because of what they do and say.

The difference between us is that I happily admit that I do it and believe that it is a good and moral basis for human interaction, while you do it and think that it is wrong and must be criticised if somebody else admits to doing it too.

 

 

on Jul 16, 2009

It's a philosphical and ethical ideal. People in prison are there because they commited crimes, but they are to be treated according to human dignity and human rights while in prison. The fact that they are criminals does not mean that they forfeited that right. I can find someone a total idiot, but that does not mean I get to treat him like one, i can't violate his human dignity just because he is one. So no, ideally we don't treat people according to our oppinion about them. That is what equality is all about - Die Würde des Menschen ist unantastbar.

Where are you getting that? I didn't say anything about how we should treat other people, just that we should not treat them all the same.

You specifically said that you treat people according to your oppinion about them.

Why do we pay some people more money? Why do I pay more for a good book than I would do for a book made of empty pages?
Demand and supply.

How the heck can treating people depending on what they say and do cause racism? It's impossible. Race doesn't come into it. Race doesn't change what an individual says or does.
It's not according to what they say and do, it is according to your interpretation of the value of what they say and do, and you can expand  the category without a problem if it's all just hinging on your perception. You have the whole thing backwards, human dignity is not the reason why we respect someones oppinion, it's is why we respect other humans as persons no matter they think or do.
Do we not treat terrorists differently from other people? Why the heck do we put them in prisons if it is wrong to treat them unequally?

You have not the right understanding of equality - it does not mean everybody gets treated the same way, it means everybody has the right to be treated with human dignity and to have his human rights respected. It does not mean that you can't send terrorists/criminals to prison, but it does mean you are not allowed to treat them inhumanely or torture them or execute them without a trial etc. because that violates their human rights. THAT is the equality, not your socialist communist interpretation where everybody is leveled onto some same form of existence and where human rights and human dignity are not respected in favour for this other form of equality.

Do you believe that one's race influences one's behaviour? I thought we, humanity, abandoned that "theory". It was very popular in the late 19th century. And it doesn't lead to good things.
No, I don't believe that and I haven't said anything to that regard.

Careful now. You are treating me according to what I said.

According to my philosophy that is great, but according to yours it could be a problem.
No it's not a problem, I respect your oppinion as a different oppinion, I just don't like what you say because I think you have the whole concept about equality backwards and your principle can be used for dangerous justifications of behaviour. Or maybe I just misunderstood you, could be.

The difference between us is that I happily admit that I do it and believe that it is a good and moral basis for human interaction, while you do it and think that it is wrong and must be criticised if somebody else admits to doing it too.

or maybe I didn't, because behaviour is not the moral compass that allows you to treat people in condescending stereotypes that might violate their human dignity. Anyway I think we've been going in circles and bored the rest to death with this philosophical excursion, but I enjoyed it so far. I never really get to debate this and it's fun to have a different oppinion to go up against.

 

on Jul 17, 2009

You specifically said that you treat people according to your oppinion about them.

Yes, but I didn't give specific instructions as to WHAT we should do to them.

That I would support torture is something you simply made up. It's not what I said. For all you know I could be in favour of giving free cake to terrorists. That would qualify as treating them differently according to my opinion about them.

 

Demand and supply.

Demand and supply is based on personal opinions. There is no magic natural constant of books we have to pay regardless of what we think about them.

 

No, I don't believe that and I haven't said anything to that regard.

In that case stop bringing up race and racism in a discussion about behaviour.

 

It's not according to what they say and do, it is according to your interpretation of the value of what they say and do, and you can expand  the category without a problem if it's all just hinging on your perception. You have the whole thing backwards, human dignity is not the reason why we respect someones oppinion, it's is why we respect other humans as persons no matter they think or do.

Are you saying that other people somehow have the magic ability to be objective whereas I have this faulty mechanism which is based on my perception of the world?

That is extremely weird.

 

No it's not a problem, I respect your oppinion as a different oppinion, I just don't like what you say because I think you have the whole concept about equality backwards and your principle can be used for dangerous justifications of behaviour. Or maybe I just misunderstood you, could be.

How could my principle possibly be used for dangerous justifications of behaviour???

And I am proud to have the concept of "equality" backwards. Most people see "equality" as evident in equal results. But people are different. Hence equality only exists if people turn out different.

 

or maybe I didn't, because behaviour is not the moral compass that allows you to treat people in condescending stereotypes that might violate their human dignity.

Yes, it is.

 

on Jul 17, 2009

 

It's not according to what they say and do, it is according to your interpretation of the value of what they say and do, and you can expand the category without a problem if it's all just hinging on your perception. You have the whole thing backwards, human dignity is not the reason why we respect someones oppinion, it's is why we respect other humans as persons no matter they think or do.

Are you saying that other people somehow have the magic ability to be objective whereas I have this faulty mechanism which is based on my perception of the world?
T

That is not what I said. If you interpret how you treat people just according to your moral compass (which could be flawed, how do you know it's not? Well Hitler used HIS, so that's allright then, right?) you would be able to justify just about anything. That's why I brought racism up as an example to discuss things on, not because you or me are racist. Nobody is able to be objective, that is why it's dangerous to use a highly subjective personal moral compass to decide who gets treated in which way.

 

on Jul 17, 2009

That is not what I said. If you interpret how you treat people just according to your moral compass (which could be flawed, how do you know it's not? Well Hitler used HIS, so that's allright then, right?) you would be able to justify just about anything. That's why I brought racism up as an example to discuss things on, not because you or me are racist. Nobody is able to be objective, that is why it's dangerous to use a highly subjective personal moral compass to decide who gets treated in which way.

And what do you suggest as an alternative?

 

Well Hitler used HIS, so that's allright then, right?

Hitler treated people differently depending on race, not their behaviour.

If Hitler had, say, invaded Poland because of something Poland did that justified an invasion, I I might not have a problem with Hitler's invasion of Poland; just like I don't have a problem with the Anglo-American invasion of France and Germany in World War 2.

A man who kills another man because that other man is a murderer is not morally the same as a man who kills another man because that other man is a homosexual.

 

 

on Jul 17, 2009

And what do you suggest as an alternative?
That is what moralethics have as their subject - how should one act? I would say that this is an complex issue because there are different theories about it. The one most prevalent in the anglosaxon school is Utilitarianism. German speaking schools like contractualism and Kant. I am not a philosophic scholar so that I could outline each different approach in detail. If you want to know more, study Emanuel Kant.

Hitler treated people differently depending on race, not their behaviour.
So how easy and logical would it be (and has been done) to argue that race determines behaviour? Because your approach is so subjective, it is farily easy to do just that, which in turn justifies prejudicial behaviour towards whomever you ostracized. All that is necessary is that certain behaviour doesn't fulfill your approved canon of what is good and right.

A man who kills another man because that other man is a murderer is not morally the same as a man who kills another man because that other man is a homosexual.
Are you serious? A murderer still has the right to be treated with human dignity because he is a human being, no matter what. Otherwise you end up on a very slippery road to morally sanctioned lynching. A man who murderse is condemnable, not matter who he murders.

on Jul 17, 2009

So how easy and logical would it be (and has been done) to argue that race determines behaviour?

It is easily possible to argue that race determines behaviour, but it has never been demonstrated that it does.

Maybe window colour determines behaviour? Who knows?

But until we have solid proof or at least some evidence that it does, there is no reason to worry about it. Race determines behaviour in the same way that window colour during the mother's pregnancy does: probably not at all.

 

Are you serious? A murderer still has the right to be treated with human dignity because he is a human being, no matter what. Otherwise you end up on a very slippery road to morally sanctioned lynching. A man who murderse is condemnable, not matter who he murders.

You keep claiming that treating people differently based on what they did is an automatic violation of human dignity. But you fail to explain how that is the case.

You have also argued that treating terrorists differently from non-terrorists is tantamount to supporting torture of suspected terrorists. Yet I cannot find any explanation for why that would be the case.

Plus you should make up your mind whether a murderer is condemnable or not. The subject of whom he murdered didn't even come up in the example. (I automatically assumed that it didn't matter.)

Is it compatible with the concept of human dignity to put an innocent man in prison for 30 years?

If it isn't, we cannot do it to a murderer either. And if it is, human dignity is not worth much in your philosophy. Either way, human dignity would be the constant.

But if the two have different levels of human dignity which allow us to imprison one but not the other, we are certainly basing out attitude towards them on what they did.

So which is it?

 

on Jul 17, 2009

I don't know all the right words in english to explain how human dignity is derived by Kant, who is the most prominent example. It's philosophy and it has its own special vocabulary. People debate each and every issue we slunk through - its always a very current isue. I really wish I was more studied in philosophy to be able to answer your objections; it is very interesting  - what is human dignity, what are human rights and under which circumstances do they apply or don't apply.. What are we allowed to do or not to do, how can we justify moral behaviour and from what is morality derived.

Alas, as I can't answer your objections in a meaningful way and also make my argument in a better way, I just have to leave things openended here. This isn't the end, I just don't have the right answers right now; and me not being to answer accordingly does not mean you are right though lol

Gruesse aus Freiburg

on Jul 20, 2009

It's philosophy and it has its own special vocabulary.

*shrug*

I read John Locke, Robert Nozick, Ayn Rand (for what it's worth), John Rawls and others.

John Locke was good. What came later appeared to have been authors trying to explain simple things with difficult words (or, in the case of Ayn Rand, make everything into a bad love story between uebermenschen). I don't think philosophy helps as much as it should.

There are no problems that can be solved by philosophers. That's why you never see job ads for them.

 

7 PagesFirst 2 3 4 5 6  Last