Brad Wardell's views about technology, politics, religion, world affairs, and all sorts of politically incorrect topics.
Environmental hypocrisy
Published on September 3, 2005 By Draginol In Politics

I cringe everytime I hear people yell about SUVs and their gas mileage. I was talking to a friend of mine in California who made some pretty...militant remarks about people who drive SUVs and their irresponsible behavior.  To which I said, "Wait, don't you commute an hour per day to work?" To which he said, "Well sure, but I drive a Toyota Corolla."  So what?

I don't care what kind of car you're driving, if you're driving over an hour (total) per day, you're burning a lot of gas. Some people have to drive that far and other people simply prefer to live out in the country.  And I have no problem with that.  But if you do live far away from work (or in the case of my friend simply have to drive through heavy traffic for long periods of time) then you can't go around condemning other people's car choices.

I don't have an SUV.  But I do have a car that only gets 18 miles to the gallon.  I also drive 6 miles to work and 6 miles home.  I spend about 20 minutes per day on the road -- total. 

The Corolla gets around 35MPG on average if you're driving it mostly in the city.  My friend drives about 25 miles each way, 50 miles per day.  So he burns 1.43 gallons of gas per day.  I burn 0.67 gallons of gas per day. Over the course of the year, he uses over 500 gallons of gas.  I use 243 gallons of gas -- less than half as much.

I don't care what kind of car other people drive.  But if you're going to take on a holier-than-thou attitude on fuel standards, then you better be factoring in your commute distance. 


Comments (Page 2)
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on Sep 04, 2005

Many people who drive an hour to work every day do it because they can not afford housing near their work. I know that is the case for many people at my work. None of us can comfortably absorb these gas prices, but housing in the city is frankly beyond us unless we stick three or four of us in one apartment.

That's fine.  But are you condemning those who save on resources by living closer to where they work but whose cars are less efficient?

I'm no environmentalist. I'm just pointing out the guy seems to feel guilty and wants to post more about it so he can try to feel better about himself. I hate wasteful people, but I have a certain tickle now when I see people with gas hogs and SUV's filling their tanks for $90 at the station. But draginol is what most people call a evergy hog, he consumers more energy and is more wasteful than 10 combined families in the United Kingdom, and seems proud of this? This is an example of everything wrong with this country. The chest pounding about the excessive energy usage is even more disturbing. No wonder the world hates Americans. Sad.

Wow, talk about projecting.  I am not sure what exactly I am allegedly feeling "guilty" about. 

Let's walk through your..ahem..logic.  You get a tickle about people paying $90 to fill their cars. Well, I hate to be the one to show you the obvious falacy of your statement but how much someone pays at the pump is purely a factor of how large their gas tank is.  If a gas tank can hold 30 gallons of gas that costs $3 /gal then it's going to cost them $90 to fill it. 

In my case, my "hog" (which isn't an SUV incidentally, it's actually a car made in the United Kingdom which is pretty ironic given your holier-than-thou attitude) burns roughly 1 gallon of gas per day (give or take).  My tank holds 18 gallons.  I don't let it go totally empty so I end up filling it every two weeks or so. 

Tell me, Steg, how much gas do you burn per day? Who's being wasteful? 

In my experience, and what inspires me to write articles like this is that hypocritical proto-environmentalists try to change the focus on gas usage away from the obvious -- HOW MUCH FUEL DO YOU USE to something fairly irrelevant -- how many miles can your car go per gallon.  And that's because, too often, the people screaming about fuel economy are the people who drive 2 hours a day.

on Sep 04, 2005
But do all big SVU's in America park anywhere they like as they do in England ?
ARE MOST OF THEM BLOCKING UP ENTRANCES TO SCHOOLS TWICE A DAY PUTTING THE PUPILS AND OTHERS IN DANGER?

It seem the cost of fuel makes no difference to peoples attitude YOU (USA) pay $3 per gallon ( big gallon) we ( UK) pay $10 per , small gallon but I reckon there are more big 4x4 BMWS PORCHES,VOLVOES,NISSANS MItsubushies here than the more economical 1-2 litre saloons
AND THEY NEVER HAVE MORE THAN ONE ADULT IN THEM.
on Sep 04, 2005
ARE MOST OF THEM BLOCKING UP ENTRANCES TO SCHOOLS TWICE A DAY PUTTING THE PUPILS AND OTHERS IN DANGER?


Are your police retarded? Or is this simply hyperbole on your part. I think the ALL CAPS speak for themselves really.
on Sep 04, 2005
Funny how many people can always shift. It's not this but that.

Truly, it's both factors: what car you drive and how many gallons you burn
on Sep 04, 2005
nice twist on things brad, so the person that walks is a better person because they use no gas at all?
on Sep 04, 2005
I agree its not entirely the problem of what vehicle people drive as to how much energy they burn. That isn't driving up gas prices. People can buy things with bad gas mileage if it pleases them. Plus manufactuers are making them, and they certainly wouldn't be doing so if people weren't buying them.
The problem is that oil/gas is becoming more and more limited. Sure the resources will still last many years, but with more countries, especially China, moving into the automotive age there is less oi/gas for everyone else.
I think the world is way behind on trying to develop other means of powering a car. Of course part of the problem isn't that they aren't trying, people aren't receptive to their attempts. Its not possible for most alternatives to achieve prices that work for the average consumer, especially where the average consumer is mainly looking for speed and fun versus simply transportation to get them from here to there. I don't completely fault the car companies, but why should they completely foot the bill for choosing alternative means of power. They don't really want to change anyway since they don't see the market there.
It starts with the governments. Of the governments would switch over to alternatives, they have a better chance of catching on and also it would be easier to implement all over. Of course I don't feel the US government anyway at all cares about alternative power. Bush is all about oil/gas. I used to be proud of this country, taking a lead in the world. More so now I feel the US is going to hell.
on Sep 04, 2005

nice twist on things brad, so the person that walks is a better person because they use no gas at all?

I'm not the one condemning people for how much fuel they use, what kind of car they drive, or how far they drive.

What I am trying (and apparently failing) to point out is that in my experience, the people who scream about SUVs tend to be people who put a LOT of miles on the car.

Perhaps it's my engineering background but this issue seems pretty straight forward.  If you're really uptight about the impact of fossil fuels have on our environment, then there's only one issue: How many gallons of said fossil fuel are you using?

Who's the bigger polluter? My retired father in law with his big, 10mpg SUV that he puts maybe 500 miles on per year? Or my holier-than-thou friend in LA who drives 500 miles per week on his Corolla?

on Sep 05, 2005
I totally agree Draginol. I take public transport myself.
on Sep 05, 2005
I refuse to pay the oil companies that are the biggest looters right now since the Hurricane in the Gulf states.
I don't drive at all now. I walk and/or ride a bike. I positioned myself in order to do that. I don't use natural gas or propane. I have things that have used petroleum based products in their manufacturing, but I propose not to buy anymore of it, ie the keyboard and computer I am writing this at among other things. I ask for paper instead of plastics at the supermarket.
So I think I can criticize the people that drive Hummers with the plastic Handicap sign hanging on the mirror... or can criticize the people who drive 250,000 motor homes that get 3 miles to the gallon that are seen up and down the tourist spots of this nation.

on Sep 06, 2005
I understand your point Brad.

I have a 3/4 ton truck that gets ~12 MPG and my commute to work is about 5 miles each way, so I burn less than a gallon per day commuting. If I have to drive to town or any other place that is a father distance I try to drive my s-10 pickup which gets 23 mpg. For me it's more about my own pocketbook and living a considerable distance from town than how much I'm burning. However it seems that if a person looks at it in the amount burned instead of mpg of the vehicle it makes alot of sense.

Many of the people where I work have gotten Geo Metros to do thier commute and they play the holier than thou game but, they have 50+ mile per day commutes so we burn essentially the same amount of fuel!
on Sep 06, 2005
Silly people. Regardless of your drive a very high MPG car is smart common sense and good for the enviroment. Driving a vehicle that gets 16-18mpg just because you have a 5 mile commute is a weak spin attempt to try and justify an excessively wasteful lifestyle. I drive a $4000.00 car I paid cash for that gets almost 40MPG not because I can't afford a Mercedes but because I want to minimize my impact on the environment and I don't want anyone to ever look down on me as a wasteful and excessive person. It is quite humbling to know I can afford anything I want but that I *CHOOSE* to drive the gas miser. Try being humble it is quite refreshing.
on Sep 06, 2005
Our family has three cars. My wife drives a 94 Ford Escort. Not really my cuppa tea (fairly uncomfortable and I don't like Fords) but it gets the job done for her. Taking the kids to school and then going to work, she uses about a tankful a week (~10 gallons).

Me...I drive a 79 Honda Civic to work. Since I commute 150 miles a day, it only makes sense to drive a car that gets 35 MPG. I rather enjoy driving my car, but that's just me. However, I do have a 99 Dakota with a nice V6 in it. Gets about 21 MPG and I usually drive that on the weekends. Why? Because I *like* to. Do I need to justify myself for driving a vehicle with sub-optimal mileage? Nope, and anyone who thinks I should can kiss my white ass.

You see, last I looked, this was still a country where we're still free to make our own choices. You can bet your bottom dollar that if I could afford to drive a 300C with a nice Hemi V-8 in it, that's what I'd be driving. But since I can't, I make do with my commuter car, and drive the less economical car on the weekends. Do I get a kick out of seeing an H2 pull into a station and pay $100+ for a fill up? You bet, but it's their choice.

All of this self-righteous BS that people *have* to drive super-eco-friendly econo-boxes really pisses me off. I wonder if people say the same thing about the folks who drive BMWs and Mercs over in the EU, paying their $6+ a gallon for fuel. As Brad said, it all boils down to overall *total* consumption, not just *rate* of consumption.

-- B
on Sep 06, 2005

Silly people. Regardless of your drive a very high MPG car is smart common sense and good for the enviroment. Driving a vehicle that gets 16-18mpg just because you have a 5 mile commute is a weak spin attempt to try and justify an excessively wasteful lifestyle. I drive a $4000.00 car I paid cash for that gets almost 40MPG not because I can't afford a Mercedes but because I want to minimize my impact on the environment and I don't want anyone to ever look down on me as a wasteful and excessive person. It is quite humbling to know I can afford anything I want but that I *CHOOSE* to drive the gas miser.


Obviously you didn't comprehend what was posted. They're refering to pickups, NOT SUV's! There isn't such a thing as a high MPG full-size pick-up. Most of us that drive them do so because we need a pick-ups capacity. There are certain things a car just won't do no matter what mileage it gets. We "choose" to drive pick-ups.
on Sep 07, 2005
Remeber, that's 18MPG in ideal conditions. Most cars use a lot more in the first few minutes of operation when they're getting warmed up, to ensure that users get the best experience possible, even at the cost of more gas. And that's just starting up in the morning. If you go to get lunch, that's another chunk gone, without actually going more than a couple of miles. Longer journies do burn up more fuel, but it's not a linear relationship.
on Sep 07, 2005

Silly people. Regardless of your drive a very high MPG car is smart common sense and good for the enviroment. Driving a vehicle that gets 16-18mpg just because you have a 5 mile commute is a weak spin attempt to try and justify an excessively wasteful lifestyle. I drive a $4000.00 car I paid cash for that gets almost 40MPG not because I can't afford a Mercedes but because I want to minimize my impact on the environment and I don't want anyone to ever look down on me as a wasteful and excessive person. It is quite humbling to know I can afford anything I want but that I *CHOOSE* to drive the gas miser. Try being humble it is quite refreshing.

Who are you to say I live a wasteful lifestyle?  You're just setting an arbitrary definition of what's "wasteful" -- and you're trying to assert that *I'm* arrogant. Amazing.

Why not bike to work? That's even less "wasteful".

I don't want anyone to ever look down on me as a wasteful and excessive person

So basically you are ruled by the opinions of other people. Well unless you're biking to work, you're a wasteful person. Go get a bike.

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