heehee. the meaningful analysis effectively ended at post #8 by jeff allison.

data in post doesn't sufficiently illustrate cause / effect.

Muggaz: I'm not saying they're lazy. I am just posting the stats.

My analysis is as follows:

Poor people are poor because they don't have jobs to earn money. (duh right?)

THey don't have jobs because of one of the following reasons:
a) They didn't finish high school which makes them unqualified for many jobs
They're lazy
c) They're disabled
d) They have a small child without child care during the day which prevents them from working

Sometimes D is related to A - they had a child while a teenager which kept them from finishing high school leaving them to take care of the child AND not be qualified for most jobs.


Wisefawn: Do you have some reason to think that the statistics have changed in the most recent census?

E) there is no job available for them

And why would there be no job for them, Jeff? Because they're not qualified for any of the available jobs? And why would that be?

g) They have medical bills they can't pay

h) They are homeless, and thus have no shower, mailbox or phone

i) Their car broke down

And more... which you can read about here

Wow, All he did was post statistics and even the amiable WiseFawn snaps like an old dried rubberband.

Crikey!

Why do people have to champion the 'poor' like it was the holy crusade? Being "poor" is more about making the wrong choices.

To get out of Poor means making the right choices.

It IS a dynamic position. A person can go from poor one year to rich the next. It isn't a completely stagnant position.

A person can go from poor one year to rich the next.

I know that the thrust of your argument is that the poor can lift themselves up, but this statement seems a bit hyperbolic.

Look at success stories, BulbousHead. With the right investment, or an idea that takes off, you can start up a company. If you're lucky, you could start up a company in your garage that becomes a "315 lbs gorilla" in the industry. But..it would never happen if you don't try, if you don't put forth the effort.

Rags to Riches, the true American Dream..coming a home near you.

With the right investment

Requires money.

an idea that takes off

Requires idea. What percent of the population is made up of innovators, entrepreneurs, and inventors?

you can start up a company

If it were that easy, everyone would be doing it.

If you're lucky, you could start up a company in your garage that becomes a "315 lbs gorilla" in the industry

And if you're not lucky, then you're poor.

Rags to Riches, the true American Dream

That's exactly what it is: a dream.

Requires money.

Money can be found by finding investors. I also think the government provides aid to help start companies (at least according to that commercial with the Riddler guy selling his Get Rich Quick book).

Requires idea. What percent of the population is made up of innovators, entrepreneurs, and inventors?

The wealthy. If a person only has the skills of a drone, do you honestly expect them to get a job beyond that of a drone?

If it were that easy, everyone would be doing it.

Everybody did do it during the dotcom era. I'm assuming it's as easy now to start a company, though not as lucrative.

And if you're not lucky, then you're poor.

A successful life depends on facing those risks.

That's exactly what it is: a dream.

It's a reality for many.

10 years ago I drove a chevette. Lived on an apartment $300 per month apartment and had an annual income >$10,000.

Today my net worth is in the 8 digit range. Hard work and sticking to things can definitely make a difference. Not that what I did can be reproduced, there's a lot of good fortunate involved too.

What people like Poet Philosopher state ignores the obvious: He states symptoms of being poor as opposed to what causes them to be poor. Not being able to afford transportation or child care or medical bills (I bet he hasn't read that book but jsut regurgitated Shipler's interview examples such as the mother whose son with Asthma had to be taken to the hospital in an ambulance and couldn't afford the ambulance so her credit rating was wrecked) are all things AFTER being poor.

For instance, the mother who was too poor to afford the ambulance is a good example. a) She didn't set up with a payment plan? They do that in inner cities and I imagine elsewhere to. She's that poor? Why does she have children in the first place? Was she ever married? Where's the father?

But those questions muddy up the sympathy picture.

It's easy to feel sorry for the 20 year old mother who has bad credit becaue of not being able to pay for an ambulance to take her poor child to emergency and therefore has to pay high interest rates to buy a new car. As mentioned in Shipler's book.

But then you look closer. And questions arise. How many people do you know have to go to the hospital from Asthma? It's almost always because they ran out of medication. How did she let that happen? Medicaid pays for Asthma medication. And she owns her own home (which is described as "drafty" -- so are many homes, but let's keep the sympathy going). And then maybe it turns out that she didn't finish high school because she got pregnant with the cidl when she was 16 and the father took off.

So what is the lesson learned? That we need to throw more money at these problems? OR maybe, JUST maybe, people shouldn't get pregnant unless they're married already and can afford children. Don't people don't where babies come from? I didn't have children until my mid twenties. Why? Because I couldn't afford children. I woudl have loved to have kids when I was younger. But I couldn't afford it.

And btw, the company that owns this website, the company I founded by myself had zero investment. I didn't borrow a cent in its founding. I just worked my ass off. Rags to riches isn't a dream. But it does require a basic handle on decent decision making.

Thanks for the vote of confidence Brad (that you posted in my "comments" section.)

You have interesting articles too.