Brad Wardell's views about technology, politics, religion, world affairs, and all sorts of politically incorrect topics.
A look at the philosophies behind two great cultures
Published on March 4, 2004 By Draginol In International

Blogs occasionally seem to have a Europe vs. United States mentality. I've seen it since the beginning of blogging. Why is that? Why is so much scorn reserved for Americans from Europeans? Why is such contempt shown for Europeans? I think I have the answer: Drastically different philosophies on life.

Europeans are focused on fairness. Americans are focused on freedom.  Europeans look at Americans as a bunch of uncultured barbarians running amok in their country and worse, through the world spreading their vulgar culture around. Americans see Europeans as a bunch of sissies whose people meekly except regulations and massive taxation in an effort to make life more "fair" for everyone.  The American response would typically be "Hey, life ain't fair!" to which the European might answer "But it should be!" And so it goes from there.

But because so many Europeans like individual Americans (and vice versa) the argument usually gets shifted to the "administrations" of the various countries.  The typical American is a nice guy right? It's not his fault that the United States is full of gun toting, capital punishment supporting, SUV driving, CO2 producing zealots. What do you expect with Bush in charge? And "Old Europe" is a mess not because of the typical Belgian or German or Frenchman, it's cynical and corrupt politicians like Chirac or Schroeder that make it seem so crummy to us.

What both fail to realize that in a democracy, the people get what they want. Sometimes it takes awhile but eventually their cultures will get a government that represents them. Some people are aghast that the United States has capital punishment. But an overwhelming majority of Americans supports capital punishment. So we elect leaders who support it. Both Kerry and Bush support capital punishment. They have to. They wouldn't get elected otherwise. But why do Americans support capital punishment? Because we're a bunch of "Cowboys"? No. It's because we believe in having a great deal of freedom in our lives but we also believe that freedom comes with a price -- personal responsibility.

Great freedom requiring personal responsibility is one of the cornerstones of American culture. And it is a relatively foreign concept to Europeans (not personal responsibility but the relationship between the two).  We pretty much allow people to do what they want here.  You can own a gun with few exceptions. There are few regulations in being an entrepreneur.  But at the same time, there are few regulations to keep a company from simply bombing on its own.  People in the United States aren't taxed very much relatively speaking. They're free to make decisions on how they want to spend the money they earn. But on the other side of the coin, they also are free to make poor choices and end up in the gutter.

I don't mean this as a criticism of Europe but Europeans have never had the kinds of freedoms Americans have. Even today. It was, after all, a big reason why so many Europeans came to the United States in the first place. The US government is formed on the basis of the federal government essentially providing a handful of essential services. It's actually the weakest central government in the industrialized world in terms of its domestic power. But Europeans have not demanded the kinds of freedoms Americans want. A European might correctly point out that too much freedom leads to chaos and anarchy. And that Europeans have chosen to pull back a bit from the brink that Americans seem so readily to jump over in order to try to create a more just society.

Remember, the French revolution cry was not freedom or death as it was in the United States. It was split amongst 3 principles: liberty, equality, fraternity. Much of "old Europe" could be described in this way. The government exists to help make things more fair -- more equal. It's not fair for some people to be incredibly rich while others are incredibly poor. A European would look at the gap between the richest Americans and the poorest Americans as evidence that the American system isn't working. An American would look at the same evidence and point out that it is working as designed. The only concern Americans would have is if the rich got rich from cheating the system in some way. Americans, generally, do not envy the rich because they believe they have a shot at being one of them if they play their cards right. And even if they don't, odds are they'll end up doing pretty well.

The descendants of Europe who live in the United States have a significantly better standard of living than anywhere else in the world. And the American system works so well that descendents from Africa have the highest standard of living of any people with African heritage in the world -- despite having been slaves only a bit over a century ago. But there's a catch (isn't there always?) The poorest Americans live pretty darn poorly compared to people in similar situations in Europe. If life were an obstacle course where 90% of the people were able to compete it and 10% didn't, the 90% in the US are rewarded far more than the 90% in Europe. But at the same time, the 10% who can't do it suffer more in the US than they do in Europe. So which path do you take?

As an American, I've been instilled with its cultural values. So I prefer freedom to fairness. I have sympathy for those who haven't been able to make the cut in American society but I also don't want to see our freedoms further eroded in order to prop them up. I don't like the way things are in "old Europe". My views aren't shared by all Americans. But they are shared by most Americans. And vice versa in Europe. And the result of democracy in action (or representative government if you're anal retentive) is that the system is set up to reflect our values -- just like the French and Germans and Belgians and so on have governments that reflect theirs. And that's a good thing.


Comments (Page 3)
11 Pages1 2 3 4 5  Last
on Mar 07, 2004
much has been spoken about the American sink-or-swim mentality, but I would like to point out that we have bought something like 5 TRILLION dollars worth of life preserves since LBJ.There comes a point when even the most determined must realize that it's pouring money down a rathole, that the problem never gets fixed, and after 35+ years, it hasn't even budged statistically.
the Euro model is different, of course, in that while it is much more difficult to succeed spectacularly, it is also much more difficult to totally fail. As an American I come down on the side of freedom, of course...of having that open door to roll the dice on my terms, win with my wit, and fail bt my own stupidity.
The sad irony of course is that neither are the Americans as free as we imagine, nor are the Euro's as secure as they might think.
Exellent food for thought though, Brad...
on Mar 07, 2004
Nazgui: I'd like to see more on this topic of the 'Hegellian Dialectic'. It is used on the American people in legislative halls each day and so few are aware of this sales tactic. I hope you'll put up some more on this tactic on a blog.

eight gates: That is the point I was making. Brad does it to create action. As owner he is slighted by everything to get blogs going. He doesn't take it personal at all. In other blogs you'll see he argues that 'Democracy' doesn't exist, then turn around and say it does. Heck, he's a Republican who says we should support the Republicrat President because he is trying to establish 'democracy' in Iraq. A greater self-refutation of party affiliation could not be imagined; yet Brad will say it if it causes reaction.

As for the generalization, it is what I try to avoid. In generalization the politician finds his safety zone and plausible deniability. Here it is used to take a slap at Europe and say "it's just a generalization" so don't take it so serious. As most members here are American he is safe to say so and gains new ups by it. Brad is the best at stirring controversy with the "vs." technique.
on Mar 08, 2004

More and more Americans today are coming to understand the terrible truth about our Federal Government -- that it seeks to dominate us as citizens, to mold us into a society of dutiful Stepford Wives totally beholden to the wishes of elite politicians, bureaucrats and bankers. Those who study history, independent of the public school system, understand that this state aggrandizement process has been under way for the past 100 years in America in one form or another. And that it is taking place because too many of our citizens sanction such dictatorial usurpation and actually work diligently for its implementation.

This process has resulted in the lion's share of our earnings being annually confiscated by these governmental elites and then redistributed to despicable projects of waste and war to further their dream of world collectivism. It has led to the shocking debasement of our currency and an endless escalation in the cost of staying alive. It has brought about the degeneration of our economy from a robust engine of industry and personal self-reliance to an effete conglomeration of bloated consumers subsisting on financial gimickery and debt addiction. As a result, America, once a proud land of muscular factories and productive people, has become a stuporous society of shopping malls and welfare crybabies. Once scintillating lives of freedom are now humdrum tenures of conformity to the insufferable Nanny State.

Why this process is taking place is one of the most disheartening questions of our time. What follows is an an attempt to show why and how it is unfolding. There are other reasons as to "why and how" than the one given here, for no country's evolution into despotism is due to a singular, clear cut cause. Tyranny's evolution is always a highly complex process with many convoluted and puzzling forces all coalescing to bring about freedom's demise. This essay, however, is a look into one of the most important of those forces.

A very popular and frightening science-fiction movie in 1956, called Invasion of the Body Snatchers, is an apt metaphor for what is taking place in our country. In the movie starring Dana Wynter and Kevin McCarthy, a network of aliens are slowly and secretly taking over the bodies of the citizens of a small town by use of mysterious cadaver-like "pods" that are left in their backyards and basements. Once transformed into an alien, each citizen then tries to recruit the rest of his family and friends. It's absolutely chilling in its impact -- one of the great science-fiction movies ever.

Today's collectivists, working so assiduously to transform America, are like the aliens in that movie. They permeate our entire society and are after not our bodies, but the enslavement of our minds and souls. Ideological fallacies and moral inversions are the mysterious pods that these aliens leave in the cerebral backyards of our lives. They are aliens because they wish to destroy our system of natural liberty and limited government. And even though most of them believe what they are doing is right, they are far from innocent, for they have chosen to blank out on the horrendous ramifications of what they are doing.


Invasion of the Mind Snatchers
on Mar 08, 2004
Two things I just thought of while reading your posts:

I don't see what freedom or fairness has to do with a federal government...? Any law, or rule, or guideline imposed by anyone is a restriction of your freedom. Why are americans focusing so much on the federal government? What about the states, the counties, the churches, the schools etc etc?

And further. What Brad said about every democratic country getting the government they diserve is only partially right, as the government also shapes it's citizens too. It goes both ways. But when reading the post before me (More and more Americans today are coming to understand the terrible truth ...) it suddenly becomes clear to me that I don't think that I have ever in my life red or heard an american with this anti-federal oppinion (which you meet every so often) who has thought that the answer to the problem is not running away (ie abandoning or minimizing the federal government) but to fight it, ie to take political action and make the government become a part of its citizens and they a part of the government.

I'm swedish and I can't for the life of me imagine how you can live in a country and have no trust at all in your government that is there to unite and help you all to work together for the benefit of all.

To us (I dare say us even if some wouldn't agree I suppose) the government is not an alien being. It is us. Me. My tax kronor don't fly off to some rich corrupt what-ever. This far in my life I'm a head. I'm 28 and with five years of free university education I can't complain, and what money I will never see myself; I'm pretty convinced that it ends up with someone who needs it.
Sure we have bad politicians too, but they are more likely to be stupid than cunning and greedy, and that makes them much less dangerous to everyone.

I don't know if this is any type of answer, but I'm pretty sure that we are much more politically active than you are, and thus forming our government after ourselves. It is not free to do what it pleases while we just suffer.

As example I'd guess that close to 85% of swedens work force is in a union. I'm guessing because I know that at my work 70% are, and that is a well known pharmaceutical company ie well paid people tend not to join a union as often. Further, in school, from 7th grade and up to 12th there are student unions that are part in how the schools are run. A lot of people are active. A friend of mine went to both north and south america spreading information to students and schools about this arrangement.

Now I'm ranting, and I dont have time to spell check. Sorry bout that. But all in all: if you like being without the federal government, thats great, and I can see how keeping such a large country united can be really hard, but I'd suggest that before you downsize what you have, try making it into what it should be instead. I don't agree with Michael Moore all the time, but his call for people to become more politically active is one I support very much.


on Mar 08, 2004
Wahkonta Anathema-Regardless of why he (Brad) makes the blog. first of all it does start up action. Even you respond to it So it does it's job, makes some people think, makes others rant/yell/demonstrate that ignorance is a deep rooted standby for everything. I subscribe!

O G San: "We are definitely drifting apart thanks to Dubya. After 9-11 everyone was on America's side, you might not believe that now but it's the truth. However Bush's arrogance has alienated most Europeans to the point where America is now hated. When New York's lights went out last year most of the people I spoke to were delighted. That's the depth of hatred."

Do me a favor and tell me, how does the hatred and delight of the European Community help anything at all? Those europeans sound just like the American nationalists in the states saying "Good, let's go over to Iraq and turn the entire middle east into a parking lot for another EuroDisney".. Which, in my opinion, makes them just as ignorant and narrow minded as the people they're "ANGRY" at for being ignorant and narrow minded. Hypocritical, much? And when did hypocrisy solve anything?

I challenge you Europeans. If you suffer from the plague known as "hate" for America because you dislike Bush or Capitalism, then find a constructive way of dealing with it.
What do you achieve by marching down the street and burning an effigy of Bush? About as little as similar protests over in the states that do the same thing..Except you convert more people to get off the fence they were straddling and become more nationalistic and hateful of You. Wow, then we do the same and convert more of you to do the same thing on Your side of the fence.. Does anyone else see where this is going? Wait, wait..it's so plain and obvious I'm sure it's overlooked..sorry for bringing it up. But if you feel you're more superior to the american breed, take it upon yourself to be enlightening and constructive. Destructive will only get us all killed.

Erm, maybe we should blow us all up? MWahahahahahahahaha Please do.

Also, not to leave anybody out, I challenge you staunt Americans to do the exact same thing with your own beefs, whether it be foreign or domestic problems that aggrivate the shiznit out of you.

With destruction comes reconstruction, so maybe you should ignore everything I typed and pick a fight. Exxxcellent.
on Mar 08, 2004
Ganglere, we do get the government we ask for. Us Americans have a government that represents us and IS US. That's why we hate it so much. It is corrupt because we are corrupt. That's why no one takes "political action" and makes the government apart of the citizens. It already is that way and would be a wasted effort.
As a society we groom our soon-to-be governors and presidents by the way we behave as a society. We teach them you have to lie and be ruthless to get ahead..If you don't swim, you sink.. Who wants a politician who always told the truth? It's a very ugly truth and frankly, we don't want to hear it. We want a charismatic leader who partially takes the reigns and does what we think best for us..and then convince us it was our idea. Americans are mad at Bush for failing to convince us we wanted the war in Iraq..not because we actually went to war.
Of course, for someone to accept my "flawed" idealogy would require looking deep within themselves and admitting things they dearly would rather not, even at the point of such denial they wouldn't know it if they did try to accept it.

Now, I'm not bashing people for feeling this way. It's perfectly understandable to let things go. Even the proactive people who challenge the government to do more and take over more control of our daily lives by providing benefits feel the same way, deep down. They just choose to present their subconscious feelings in a different way than angry apathy. Sometimes it bursts forth as righteous fury and what have not.

Do we hate our government? No. If we did, we would change it. We know from our birth we have the power to make changes. We know we can break away from an evil dictator. It is ingrained in us by schooling and adults until we become adults and tell our children about it. WE KNOW WE ARE FREE..but we don't want to be Completely free.
The only ones who want to be totally free set up complexes somewhere in Montana and convince others to join them..(The leader wants to rule and the rest just want to be lead around by the nose by a different leader than mainstream ones..and therefore do not want complete freedom either..)

Freedom, scary thought, isn't it? Kinda like the Wild West..thank God we tamed that and put control on it

We get the kind of government we want, even if we do not admit it. Just watch during the next elections.

Vive Le Lunaticus Minimus!
This has been a message brought to you by the Chaotic Neutral Political Party. If you're going to vote, make sure you do it with your pants on.
on Mar 10, 2004
Today, the United States is governed by a junta of war criminals who took power through a kind of coup. That coup may have been preceded by (dubious) elections: but we should never forget that Hitler was also an elected politician. In this analogy, 9/11 fulfils the function of the "burning of the Reichstag", allowing the junta to grant its police force powers similar to those of the Gestapo. They have their own Mein Kampf -- the National Security Strategy --, their own mass associations -- the patriot organisations -- and their own preachers. It is vital that we have the courage to tell these truths, and stop masking them behind phrases such as "our American friends" that have by now become quite meaningless.

Political culture is the long-term product of history. As such, it is obviously specific to each country. American political culture is clearly different from that which has emerged from the history of the European continent: it has been shaped by the establishment of New England by extremist Protestant sects, the genocide of the continent's indigenous peoples, the enslavement of Africans, and the emergence of communities segregated by ethnicity as a result of successive waves of migration throughout the 19th century.

Modernity, secularism and democracy are not the result of an evolution in religious beliefs, or even a revolution; on the contrary, it is faith which has had to adjust to meet the requirements of these new forces. This adjustment was not unique to Protestantism; it had the same impact on the Catholic world, though in a different way. A new religious spirit was born, liberated from all dogma. In this sense, it was not the Reformation that provided the pre-condition for capitalist development, even though Weber's thesis has been widely accepted in the Protestant societies of Europe, which were flattered by the importance it gave them. Nor did the Reformation represent the most radical possible break with Europe's ideological past and its "feudal" system, including earlier interpretations of Christianity; on the contrary, the Reformation was simply the most confused and most primitive form of such a rupture.

One aspect of the Reformation was the work of the dominant classes, and led to the creation of national churches (Anglican or Lutheran) controlled by these classes. As such, these churches represented a compromise between the emerging bourgeoisie, the monarchy and the large landowners, through which they could hold at bay the threat posed by the poor and the peasantry.

Effectively marginalising the Catholic idea of universality by establishing national churches served in particular to reinforce the power of the monarchy, by strengthening its role as arbitrator between the forces of the old regime and those of the ascending bourgeoisie, and reinforcing those classes' nationalism, thus delaying the emergence of the new forms of universalism which would later be promoted by internationalist socialism.

However, other aspects of the Reformation were driven by the lower classes, who were the main victims of the social transformations triggered by the birth of capitalism. These movements resorted to traditional forms of struggle, derived from the milleniarist movements of the Middle Ages; as a result, far from leading the way, they were fated to lag behind the needs of their age. The dominated classes would have to wait until the French Revolution -- with its secular popular and radical democratic forms of mobilisation -- and the advent of socialism to find ways to effectively articulate their demands in relation to the new conditions in which they lived. The early modern Protestant groups, by contrast, thrived on fundamentalist illusions, and this in turn encouraged the infinite replication of sects in thrall to the same kind of apocalyptic vision which is currently proliferating across the US.

The Protestant sects who were forced to emigrate from 17th century England had developed a peculiar form of Christianity, distinct from both Catholic and Orthodox dogma. For that matter, their brand of Christianity was not even shared by the majority of European Protestants, including the Anglicans who made up the majority of the British ruling class. In general terms, we can say that the essential genius of the Reformation was to reclaim the Old Testament, which Catholicism and the Orthodox Church had marginalised when they defined Christianity as a break with Judaism. The Protestants restored Christianity to its place as Judaism's rightful successor.

The particular form of Protestantism that found its way to New England continues to shape American ideology to this day. First, it facilitated the conquest of the new continent by grounding its legitimacy in scriptural reference (biblical Israel's violent conquest of the promised land is a constantly reiterated theme in North American discourse). Later, the US extended its god- given mission to encompass the entire globe. Thus North Americans have come to regard themselves as the "chosen people" -- in practice, a synonym for the Nazi term, Herrenvolk. This is the threat which we are facing today. And this is why American imperialism (not "Empire") will be even more brutal than its predecessors, most of whom never claimed to have been invested with a divine mission.

I am not among those who believe that the past can only be repeated. History transforms people. This is what has happened in Europe. Unfortunately however, American history, far from working to erase the horror of its origins, has instead reinforced that horror's hold and perpetuated its effects. This is true of both the American "Revolution", and the country's settlement through successive waves of migration.

The American Ideology
on Mar 10, 2004
Lunaticus, I don't hate the US at all, as I made clear in my post. If you'd bothered to quote the next two sentences:

"I don't hate America but I do hate what your govt is doing. Others dont make that distinction."

that woul've made it abundantly clear.

Some people in Europe hate America, not just your govt. This is dehumanising and stupid because it ascribes one set of characteristics (basically arrogant belligerence) to 280 million people. It doesn't take a genius to work out that not all Americans are like Donald Rumsfeld. Such is the anger about the Iraq war that some Europeans are losing sight of this distinction which is unfortunate.

Your point about protests is way off the mark. The anti-war protests weren't aimed at Bush as much as pro-war European leaders. The biggest protests last February were in London, Barcelona and Madrid - in countries whose governments were pro-war. They were designed to show Blair and Aznar that they were going to war against the wishes of their people ("not in my name"). If Americans were offended by millions on the march in Europe then tough, be offended, it's called democracy.
on Mar 10, 2004
Naz,
Very deep, the depth of your post is overwhelming, I concur with your historical points, but to draw comparisons to Hitler is
a huge s t r e t c h, to think that our government has been hijacked is ludicris.
on Mar 18, 2004
I think the distinction lies in the american view of freedom as negative or formal freedom and european view freedom as positive and substantial freedom. Its just a play with words, but it presents a more neutral case IMO.
on Mar 26, 2004
O.G. I can be wrong and often am. I excersize my right to be wrong, as well. However, maybe it's unfair for me to characterize based off of those international people I've spoken to elsewhere. My reply was written with the words of those foreign nationals who yell "All Americans are stupid cowboy yanks". I think there are alot more of those than rightly safe to admit. I've also seen the war on the other side of the fence with Americans saying the same thing. That was the point I was mentioning.
on Mar 26, 2004
People say our country doesn't fend for the poor. I find that hard to believe since the last budget I looked at put Low-Income Assistance at third place after payments to the elderly and national defense respectively. The thing is, is that people have to be willing to work too. All too often, people will get the assistance they need, only to use it on something useless (like a big-screen tv) instead of getting something they need to get a job (like more education maybe). On top of that, grants are all over the place for people to go back to school. It's just a matter of whether or not people are willing to work for it, and commonly, people who are poor are unwilling to work which is why they're poor in the first place.

Woot, I got an A on my last differential equations test!
on Mar 26, 2004
Many Americans seem alienated from their brethren and spiteful of people who they don't know. Nobody seems to share the same history or heritage. Californians are different from Southerners are different from Midwesterners are different from New-Englanders. We all started out with some basic liberal principals and everyone went their own ways and has interpreted them differently. There seems to be alot of polarization and distrust, but because we are so fiercely individualistic, because the nation is so damn huge and multicultural, and because the media and culture war have emphasized political differences over REAL commonalities, we don't consider our 'oneness' to be a core value.

Many Europeans have this perception that they've been with their people for thousands of years, and they have a love and common interest for their people. Their national borders are also borders of culture, ethnicity, and religious and social history, and their populations are largely homogenous, especially when you start looking at the progressive Scandinavian countries. They don't have to deal with so many of challenges that we do, and since they don't feel a cultural rift between themselves and other groups in their country, they are less inclined to begrudge other people their tax money to help them out. However, they are probably less sympathetic to immigrants and racially diverse groups than we are.
on Mar 28, 2004
But definitely Europe is more civilized than the United States: abolishment of the death penalty, legalization of light drugs and concern for environment (a civilized person doesn't shit everywhere).
on Mar 28, 2004

Big Mammal: That's your evidence?  No death penalty and drugs allowed?

How about a reality check:

1) Concern for the environment? That total BS. European countries, including France, allowed LEAD in their gas into the 1990s. The average American's air is much cleaner than the average European's air.

2) More civilized? Which continent has seen MULTIPLE attempts at genocide? The civilized Europeans exterminated 12 million of its own people intentionally and just to be sure that we didn't think taht was a one time thing, the Balkans gave us the term "ethnic cleansing".

3) Anti-semitism and other forms of racism are pretty high there. Heck Europeans don't like each other very well. Racial hatred of Albanians is pretty high in southern Europe. German racism towards Turks is pretty acute and the French..well the French..

When the US starts building factories to exterminate its racial minorities then we can talk about the US having a civilization problem.

11 Pages1 2 3 4 5  Last