Brad Wardell's views about technology, politics, religion, world affairs, and all sorts of politically incorrect topics.
When labels no longer work
Published on December 14, 2005 By Draginol In Politics

Liberal. Conservative.  These terms have lost all meaning in recent years. They are effectively political party names in terms of usefulness as a description.  We need new names.  But what should they be?

Many people have pointed out that American politics is over-simplified.  Two political parties? Two political philosophies? Nonsense.  I have come to agree with them.

So for the sake of this exercise I've devised 6 political philosophies that permeate the American politic.

  • Moderate Libertarians (not the political party)
  • Capitalists
  • The Religious Right Movement
  • Social Justice Movement
  • Transnational Progressives
  • Nationalists

Some of these political movements overlap considerably.  For the sake of our exercise (so that we can agree on terminology at least) here are some common political issues and their positions:

+ = favors, - = opposes, / = neutral, * = no consensus

Philosophy TransPro Social justice Nationalists Libertarian Capitalists Religions Right
Abortion Rights + + / + + -
Tax Cuts - - / + + /
Prayer in School / - / - / +
War in Iraq - / + / / +
Minimum Wage Laws / + / - - /
Campaign Finance Reform / + - - - -
Drug Legalization + / - + - -
Universal Healthcare + + / - / -
Outsourcing of jobs - - - + + /
Free Trade * - + + + /
Strong US Military - / + / + +
Unconditional Freedom of speech - / - + / -
Affirmative Action / + - - - -
Death Penalty - - + - / +
Regulation of industry + + + - - +

Now we don't necessarily need to agree on the positions for the labels since the labels are arbitrary. I could have named them View #1, View #2, etc.  But hopefully the names roughly correspond with what you (the reader) think those of that view would favor/oppose on the various issues.  The shaded values are my positions on a given issue. In the event there are multiple philosophies with the same view, I shaded the one that I felt closest matched my reasoning for having that position.

Here's what I had in mind:

The Libertarians essentially are the group that believes that individuals should be in control of their destinies and that the government has no business interfering. The government's basic justification for existence is to keep people from resorting to violence.  If they had their way, the government would largely be basically the police, courts, and military. 

The Capitalists are the group that believes that capitalism can solve everything. The free market is king and whenever something -- anything -- goes wrong then "the market" will present a solution if left alone.

The Religions Right are the group that believes we are one nation, under God and want to ensure that we live in a moral (by their definition) society.

Nationalists are the group that believes that the United States has a special place in the world and a mission to make the world safe for democracy. American values and traditions should be spread aggressively across the world to make a better world.

The Social Justice crowd believe that life should be more fair for all of our citizens and that the government should play the role of social umpire.  The haves and have-nots should be kept within reason.

The Transnational Progressives see themselves as citizens of the world. In their mind, the future belongs to them as an international order will create a safer more civilized world.

Today's modern conservatives are often made up by people like Tucker Carlson who are essentially libertarians.  But capitalists and religious right get lumped in there as well even though they all have very different views from one another. Similarly, the nationalists are in there as well.  Today's modern liberals get the latter two groups lumped in mostly. 

Left vs. Right

In a recent article I argued that the liberal philosophy was dying in the United States because its proponents were not effectively advocating the legitimacy of their issues.  Those who disagreed with me tried to argue that both sides have their extremes and that I was basically just ranting about those who disagreed with my views.  And while that is true that some conservatives are intolerant and nutty the reality is that, overwhelmingly, regardless of where you look today, the ones who resort to violence or extreme tactics are almost universally on the left.  But which left?

It's no coincidence that my chart above is broken into six columns. While each group is not quite proportionally divided, I think it's grossly accurate.  That is, roughly 1/6th of the American population is "The Christian Right".  1/6th is Libertarian. 1/6th Transnational Progressives, and so forth.  

Since liberals tend to make up the left-two columns, that means their support is only, at most, 1/3rd with the other 2/3rd being conservative.  If you take the middle half of each group, you end up with 1/6th liberal, 2/6ths conservative, and 3/6ths (half) "moderate".  Incidentally, in the 2004 election, 21% of people described themselves as liberal, 45% as moderate, and 34% as conservative.  Which, if described in terms of 6ths comes out to what I just postulated.

I think one of the reasons why the modern liberal ideology is losing steam (in my opinion) is that they've not changed (I mentioned this last time) and as a result, have lost a lot of support amongst the Libertarian side of things.  Pure libertarians have a lot in common with liberals -- pro-choice, pro-legalized drugs, anti-death penalty.  I think what we've seen in American politics is the libertarians (not talking about the Libertarian party) have ended up siding more and more with the group lumped together as "conservatives".

Part of the reason that I think there are fewer liberals today is, like I said previously, many liberals have started treating their philosophy as a religion with no room for heretics. You either buy into the whole line or you're out. As many have written, modern liberals are often incredibly intolerant of opposing views because they see those who oppose them as being uncivilized, unenlightened and downright "evil".  And while there are conservatives that are the same way they don't make up anywhere near the same percentage of the conservative movement.  You can demonize Christians as being a bunch of "hateful bigots" all day but they only make up around 1/6th of the population (in the 2004 election, the CNN exit poll showed they were about 20%).

Levers of Power

So where's the evidence or at least the sound analysis proving that liberals are less effective at advocating their philosophies? Is there some sort of "bad gene" that makes them less capable of making the case for their philosophy? Of course not.  Instead, I argue that in a broad sense it comes down to conservatives holding the levers of power in the real world and the liberals looking in from the outside.  Because liberals rarely are running the show in the real world anymore, their criticisms are more likely to be empty.  That is, it's easier to bitch about what the guy in charge is doing than to actually provide a workable solution.

To illustrate that, I'll generalize broadly some typical jobs based on philosophy. Obviously this is by no means complete but I'm just providing some examples to illustrate the point.

Philosophy Typical Jobs / Responsibilities
Religious Right Home maker, Parent, Home schooler, Minister
Capitalist Businessman, business executive
Nationalist Soldier, Right-Wing politician
Libertarian Engineer, Entrepreneur
Social Justice Journalist, Social Worker, Democratic party politician, Exception to rule finder
Transnational Progressive Professional protester, Liberal Arts Professor

Feel free to disagree but only if you're disagreeing with the generalization. Of course there are engineers who favor social justice and there are journalists who are amongst the religious right. If you are one of those people who hate generalizations then you're probably in the social justice crowd.

Source of frustration

To recap where we are at: I believe that "liberals", as a broad group, are less effective at debating because their philosophy now encapsulates a much smaller percentage of the population today than it did even 10 years ago.  Besides anecdotal evidence to support that, exit polls seem to support that as well. Fewer and fewer people describe themselves as being left-wing in the United States.  While conservatives and liberals have their share of kooks, because liberals are fewer in number, the kooks represent a larger %.  That is, if 10% on each end of the population are basically nuts, then the side the has fewer adherents is going to have a larger share of them that are just plain nuts. 

As a result, while the conservatives are saddled with religious extremists who go around bombing abortion clinics and have leaders who say stupid stuff, that's only representative of a fraction of the religious right and the religious right only make up a small percentage now of those who today find themselves throwing their lot in with the group that widely calls themselves "conservative".  By contrast, the kooks on the left may be roughly the same in number in absolute terms but because they represent a larger percentage of their movement, their voices get heard a lot more and carry more weight within the movement.

That is why people the right find loathsome like Michael Moore or Cindy Sheehan can go to a college campus and give a speech without incident while people on the right such as William Kristol (of the Weekly Standard) or Ann Culter can expect to be physically assaulted or have their speeches interrupted or disrupted by protesters. 

My frustration with the left starts there -- their intolerant elements seem to be in control of the entire movement.  The ones who like to call people fascists and compare people to Nazis seem to be unaware that in action, they resemble their epitaphs much more closely than their targets. 

But the frustration doesn't end there.  In the past, the social justice crowd had a pretty firm lock on the media.  But the rise of blogs and conservative media has helped break that hold.  As a result, the left has lost more and more influence on the American public and in turn, lost control of more levers of power in American society.  In the past few years, this has transformed the liberal movement from the philosophy of new ideas to the philosophy of idle bitching and moaning and perpetual victimhood.  

What good is a new idea if you're not in a position to implement? It's as if subconsciously, the best and brightest progressives have given up on putting together solutions to the worlds problems and decided to join the chattering class. Instead of proposing new ideas, they seem content to just bitch about "the man" and how "the man" is keeping them down.  The man got us into Iraq. The man is doing a bad job there.  The man is outsourcing jobs to India.  The man is bringing in products from China.  The man is destroying the environment.  Without the burden of having to implement ideas, the left has found itself free to just complain about the solutions "the man" is implementing. 

If someone demands an alternative from the left, the result is usually some half-baked idea.  "You can't drill in ANWR!"  "But we need more energy." "Then we should switch to alternative energy sources and conserve energy."  And voila, the pesky part of how to implement such a massive proposal is left to others.  And when those others even try to implement an alternative, the nitpicking continues "Oh you can't put a wind farm there. It obstructs our view/kills birds/looks ugly" "Oh you can't use nuclear power, it's bad, man. Bad!"). 

Conclusions

The combination of the left being more represented by its extremists and no longer being in a position of power has created a negative feedback cycle. Frustrated with their lack of power, the extremists get more shrill, more totalitarian which in turn drives more people into the conservative tent which in turn makes the left even more frustrated with even less power and so on.

What would be most beneficial, and something that may happen in the next few decades, would be the split up of the major US political parties.  Either the Republican side will get so big that it'll split into new parties or perhaps the Democrats will jettison the left-wing fringe and move more to the center.  The Democrats used to have a significant chunk of the nationalists and many libertarians for instance.  Or perhaps something else entirely such as the Libertarian party getting rid of its kooks and becoming more mainstream and siphoning off a lot of conservatives turning the Republicans into a religious right party. 

What I'd like to see happen would be for the Democrats and the left in general to move a bit back to the right so that the fringe elements aren't so much in the spotlight.  We'll see. What do you think?


Comments (Page 1)
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on Dec 14, 2005
Very interesting, and very well thought out. I agree with you a hundred percent that lumping an extremely diverse country like the U.S. into two political groupings is ridiculous. (However, regardless of who ultimately has power neither the Repubs or the Dems are likely to "allow" another party anytime soon, unfortunately.) I also think the criticism I've heard from some of the more rational "conservatives" on JU and elsewhere about "liberals" being too much bleeding heart and mouth, and too little action or plan, is potentially valid. As someone on the "left" I'm willing to take this possibility under consideration and think of ways to remedy it. I also appreciate your acknowledgement of the power-brokering that people tending towards the "right" are more often capable of.

My only criticism would be the way you touch on "conservative" power, and move right on in to dooming "liberals" for their talk. While this is not untrue, the answer also lies within your graphs. T.P's and S.J's (arguably S.J.'s more) are doing more than talk. They're working in careers that they see as working towards a greater good. People in the R.R. would fall under this too. From social workers to ministers, these are not the places of power or bucks. "Lefties" may be somewhat responsible for losing two elections in a row. But part of that responsibility may lie in allowing the "righties" to hold all the cards, frame the issues in a manner that favors them, and maintain all the positions of power. Democrats are no more out of touch with the people than Republicans are. (And I'm using the party names deliberately here.) Dems are just more out of touch with the latest and greatest "spin" and "brainwashing" techniques. Great job! (And thanks for encouraging an actual, rational political debate on JU.) Cheers.
on Dec 14, 2005

Dems are just more out of touch with the latest and greatest "spin" and "brainwashing" techniques. Great job! (And thanks for encouraging an actual, rational political debate on JU.) Cheers.

Hmm.  I don't think that's the issue. I don't think Americans are being brain-washed or fooled or tricked into voting for Republicans.  I think the issue is simply that the Republicans simply have a broader level of support for the positions most Americans believe in.  Or at the very least, trust the Republicans to do less damage.

Look at the whole Iraq thing. You'd think that the Democrats were against going into Iraq, yet most of them voted for it.  Now some of them act like they were "tricked" by Bush.  This is a losing proposition in a number of ways.  Either you take them at their word and believe the guy they've labeled as the "smirking chimp" may be stupid but is still smarter than they are OR you don't believe them (and I don't) and think they simply voted yes for political expedience and now are against the war for the same reason. In either case, it doesn't tend to translate into broad spectrum support of the public.

The left doesn't "allow" the righties to hold onto the cards.  I believe that the values that each of the 6 groups hold lead them into careers that have their corresponding values.  Someone who truly is into social justice may become a public school teacher or a journalist or a social worker but regardless, at the end of the day, they're still a teacher, journalist, or social worker.  They'll never have (on average) the influence of a businessman, entrepreneur, or even minister.  Similarly, those who largely determine foreign policy tend to be nationalists.  The media or the professor can rail all the want about foreign policy but they don't actually decide foreign policy, at most they influence it.

on Dec 14, 2005
"Look at the whole Iraq thing. You'd think that the Democrats were against going into Iraq, yet most of them voted for it.  Now some of them act like they were "tricked" by Bush.  This is a losing proposition in a number of ways.  Either you take them at their word and believe the guy they've labeled as the "smirking chimp" may be stupid but is still smarter than they are OR you don't believe them (and I don't) and think they simply voted yes for political expedience and now are against the war for the same reason. In either case, it doesn't tend to translate into broad spectrum support of the public." —quoting Draginol

But this is exactly what I'm talking about, and I agree with you. Whoever is deciding political plays for the Dems is a moron. I don't think, (and this is just my opinion,) that the Republicans (as a party; I'm not talking about individual, average "conservative voters") have the public's best interest at heart, any more than I think the Dems do, (again, as a party, not individual, average "liberal voters"). The Repubs are just better at power brokering. I think that if you get down to people, to individuals, we all have more in common than not. However, this opinion will not make you very popular with anyone, on any side, who is convinced they hold the keys to 'rightness.'
on Dec 14, 2005
Oh, I also want to add—I don't want to imply that those who vote Republican are "brainwashed" or incapable of thinking for themselves. I do think that 'spin' has power over the way people view things, but I think at this juncture, in the U.S. we're all, on some level, voting for what we consider the lesser of two evils. As you said, the extreme kooks on either side are in the minority. Everyone is just muddling through as best they can with only two parties to choose from.
on Dec 15, 2005
That is, if 10% on each end of the population are basically nuts, then the side the has fewer adherents is going to have a larger share of them that are just plain nuts. It wouls seem to me that 10% is 10% regardless; since there are more extremist on the right there is greater kookiness than those on the left.
By contrast, the kooks on the left may be roughly the same in number in absolute terms but because they represent a larger percentage of their movement, their voices get heard a lot more and carry more weight within the movement. What happened to the absolute 10%?

In the past few years, this has transformed the liberal movement from the philosophy of new ideas to the philosophy of idle bitching and moaning and perpetual victimhood. Probably a natural quantity of being out of power.

Frustrated with their lack of power, the extremists get more shrill, more totalitarian[?] which in turn drives more people into the conservative tent which in turn makes the left even more frustrated with even less power and so on. There is a difference you know between totlitarian and unilaterally renegado.
on Dec 15, 2005
btw, still a very impressive article, which if it did not lapse so often into the subliminal thrust of bashing liberalism, it would be thoroughly honest.
on Dec 15, 2005
Up until the "Left vs. Right" header it's just establishing what I hope all can agree on.  After the "Left vs. Right" header it falls into analysis which is  more subjective.
on Dec 15, 2005
Very good article!!! I think we should start a petition to get it featured! ;~D

To me, the party affiliation doesn't usually tell me much. But how a person describes themselves tells me a lot. There may not be "a dime's worth of difference between a democrat and a republican", but there is between a self defined liberal democrat and conservative republican. For that matter, conservatives and liberals of the same party will usually differ much more those of different parties.

That works for people who define themselves using those terms, but the challenge comes when people define others. I figure I'm not right wing, but I do sit to the right of the aisle on the plane. I have been called a conservative, a liberal and a moderate. When others define me it is usually based on one or two issues, and the point of reference from the person defining me.

I think that's why we do run in to so many problems when we define someone else. All we have to go on is our own point of reference.
on Dec 15, 2005
“Or at the very least, trust the Republicans to do less damage.” The same holds true when the Democrats are in power. By definition the elected party is due to the perception that they will do less damage.
Business, entrepreneurism, and religion have no interest in social justice, eh?

“those who largely determine foreign policy tend to be nationalists”
it is the converse: foreign policy effects nationalism.
Why are you so hell bent on painting these broad strokes? Democrats are not trying to protest the war all over again; they know it’s living history; but it is not to embarrass the administration, rather to arrive at railroading data that pre-conditioned the erroneous vote. The point of the war was imminent threat, which apparently didn’t exist. You have turned the “smirking chimp" into the smirking Dem.
on Dec 15, 2005
Stevendallas, your reaction is exactly the point. You know that Prs. Bush never said Iraq was an "eminent threat", in fact he said that they aren't, but we shouldn't wait until Hussein IS an eminent threat.

Making the current administration look bad is the entire point (at least at the party level). No matter how much progress is made in Iraq, they say nothing has been accomplished. No matter how many times the president repeats the goals and mission, they say, "but what's the exit strategy". Meanwhile they contribute only ideas on how we can lose the most strategically... Apparently they don't care if the U.S. loses in Iraq, or if the people of Iraq end up in the hands of the bacteria. To them there is only 1 war, and that is for the White House and they consider any loss "acceptable" if it furthers that cause.

If democrats aren't trying to protest the war all over again, why do they keep using the same tired arguments they have from the beginning? Even worse, why do they continue to campaign against a president who isn't running for office anymore... and can't ever again?
on Dec 15, 2005
I disagree with your labels.

For example, your "nationalist" is actually a "patriot".

David Duke is a nationalist.

Adolph Hitler was a nationalist.

Saddam Hussein is a nationalist.

American patriots are not nationalists.

I posted what I think is a good description of "conservative" at https://forums.joeuser.com/Forums.aspx?ForumID=3&AID=94821#740902.
on Dec 15, 2005

That is, if 10% on each end of the population are basically nuts, then the side the has fewer adherents is going to have a larger share of them that are just plain nuts. It wouls seem to me that 10% is 10% regardless; since there are more extremist on the right there is greater kookiness than those on the left.
By contrast, the kooks on the left may be roughly the same in number in absolute terms but because they represent a larger percentage of their movement, their voices get heard a lot more and carry more weight within the movement. What happened to the absolute 10%?

If 40% of the population is left, and 60% right, then 10% of the population is 1 in 10.  FOr the left that means that 1 in 4 are kook.  For the right, that means 1 in 6.  The 10% is as a percentage of the total populatio, not of each side.

on Dec 15, 2005
I think the article is excellent as well, and while I appear to be mostly in the libertarian camp, there are a couple of issues that I still do not toe the line (so to speak) on.  But 6 is better than 2.  I guess trying to get more than a handful of people to agree on all issues 100% is like herding cats.
on Dec 15, 2005
I agree the left gets passionate about a greater range of subjects than the right. Abortion is about the only thing the right gets passionate about. Ask a devout pro-lifer if killing an unborn child is merely an apposing point of view. Issues like the environment and using bombs to effect political changes are similar black and white issues to the left.

Two guys, one liberal one conservative, are sleeping in the same bed together. (The conservative on the right side of the bed of coarse and the bed being a metaphor for life) The conservative falls to sleep first and begins to spread out and hog all the covers. The liberal in an effort not to be touched by any conservative parts moves farther to left side of the bed almost falling off. While the conservative slumbers he dreams a homosexual fantasy. When he awakes shocked by his dream runs off to church and asked god to remove these thoughts of perversion. This is where he learns of the liberal agenda to destroy Christianity, promote homosexuality and dam us all to Gods wrath.

Its all BS, most people couldn’t even tell what all these different ideologies mean. They believe what they were taught to believe and in an effort to fit in what everyone else around them believes. You think upon a conservative awakening people pack it up and move to a red state. Shifts towards the left or the right sadly have more to do with who’s breading faster than the strength or weaknesses of a given ideology.
on Dec 15, 2005
Shifts towards the left or the right sadly have more to do with who’s breading faster than the strength or weaknesses of a given ideology.


Now there's an "enlightened" liberal point of view.

Cheers,
Daiwa
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