Brad Wardell's views about technology, politics, religion, world affairs, and all sorts of politically incorrect topics.
How multiplayer impacts design
Published on April 23, 2006 By Draginol In GalCiv Journals

Last week I wrote about whether strategy games need multiplayer.  There are definitely strong feelings on the matter.

In the article, I referred to blogs written by top reviewers Bruce Geryk and Troy Goodfellow.  I want people to understand something specifically -- I referred to them because they are top reviewers in their field. They did not take any points off of GalCiv II because it lacked multiplayer. They were putting forth the reason why many people are passionate about multiplayer in strategy games.

For the people who have a group of friends that they play multiplayer with, then a multiplayer feature in GalCiv II would be ideal.  And for those people, having multiplayer allows the game to have a much longer lifespan on their hard drives.  My favorite PC game of all time is Total Annihilation. But if it didn't have multiplayer, it wouldn't have survived very long on my hard drive. It was its multiplayer that made it so popular.

In many respects, what I'm writing about and what multiplayer advocates are writing about go right past each other.  My argument is that multiplayer advocates have plenty of options to choose from.  Not only have most strategy games of the past 5 years put a lot of energy into multiplayer (Age of Empire 3, Civilization 4, Rise of Nations, etc.) but even this year there will be turn based games with significant multiplayer components such as Space Empires V, Sword of the Stars, HOMM 5.  The developers of Sword of the Stars argue that putting in multiplayer has no negative impact on the single player experience.  I'll have to disagree.  In having either designed, developed or been heavily involved in Entrepreneur, Trials of Battle, Stellar Frontier (a multiplayer space game with the Drengin, Arceans and Terran Alliance btw), The Corporate Machine, and The Political Machine, (GalCiv being the only game I've done that isn't multiplayer btw), I think I have some experience in being able to say that yes, having multiplayer changes the way the game is designed.  When I designed The Political Machine, I imagined how it would be played multiplayer first and then wrote the AI as a simulated on-line opponent.  I think The Political Machine turned out pretty well as a single player game still, but it's a very different game than it would have been had it only been a single player game. I would have made it so that top players would have a lot more data and information to put together far more sophisticated strategies.

Making GalCiv II have multiplayer as a checkbox is pretty easy. You could just send the saved game back and forth between players. But would people be satisfied with that?  Some would.  But even doing that adds time to the development schedule. It still adds budget, and you still have a bunch of other things that could make the experience non-ideal.  I'd rather a game decide what it wants to be. If you're going to have multiplayer, do it right.  And in my experience, doing it right means having multiplayer be part of the design.  In GalCiv II, we put in the piping so that we could do multiplayer later on.  But in terms of time and energy, we wanted to focus everything on making the single player experience satisfying.

The point on multiplayer isn't whether a strategy game should have it or not as much as what priority it should have in the development of a game.  Heck, if I had more development resources, I'd take the GalCiv II engine and make an RTS version of it. I'd love to see my designed ships up against someone else's in battle.


Comments (Page 2)
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on Apr 23, 2006
I have no interest at all in any form of multiplayer for GC2. I respect the fact the there are those who feel quite differently, but multiplayer is not what keeps a game on my hard drive. For example, I'm still playing Neverwinter Nights (a pretty darn old game) and I do enjoy the benefits of being online (as I have downloaded quite a few mods), but I've never played it multiplayer and I don't feel that I'm missing anything. It's still fun and fresh enough to get regular play and that is really all it takes for a game to stay on my hard drive. Is multiplayer the new black?
on Apr 23, 2006
I am not interested in multiplayer.

You should spend your resources making it possible to submit every game set up for the metaverse.

If you want to expand your market, then multi player is probably a good idea.
You are canvassing the wrong people.
You should be asking those who have not bought GC2.
on Apr 23, 2006
Well we gots to keep it real. MP, yes sure. However, Not at the cost of features/updates/expansions or modding support.

I'm so wishing version 1.2 was final already and we're talking about expansions, ship packs and multiplayer. Mods Mods Mods. Modding is SO cool. Mods keep games on my hard drives longer.

Yes, I want it all and willing to purchase all. Asking me what takes priority ? Top Notch "AAA " single player experience is what I was sold on. So inclusion of MP makes me wonder "At what cost / expense " to other things ? Keep the impact minimal is what I hope for. Would I use MP per se? Doubtful.
on Apr 23, 2006
Would I buy an expansion with added multiplayer as its only content? No. I would much rather see Terror Stars, different Government trees (rather than a simple, obvious progression from one inferior type to a superior form), and more interesting techs like Cloaking, Interdiction, and a million others I could list.

Amen
on Apr 23, 2006
The pbem concept would work nicely for professionals. I didn't really think about it until now. The last time I considered pbem was when X-Com had the pbem thing. These days, I'm on a tight schedule. I get an hour of leisure time per day and it's not always for GC2 as much as I wish it were. I'm getting about 5 hours a week with this game. My friend is of equal skill and equally strapped for time. As I've voiced my political opinion on the matter--the game isn't ideal yet so no mp at the expense of sp--your request is for feature suggestions:

Play by email. It would have a negligible to nonexistent effect on the single player game. All players should be allowed to use custom races. Play by email just sounds like the most attractive option but I'm admittedly not familiar with it. Does it allow more than two players?

The second option is LAN & IP. Forget battle.net. Think more along the lines of Doom 1. The people that do GC2 are going to deal among themselves. Your audience is smarter than the latest ghey FPS player and they are likely to be part of the lunatic fringe of technology politics (I am.)

I don't want to deal with any third party to setup a game, period.

I'm going to give Stardock more credit than the single-player Nazis are doing. I want features above all else. Stardock has demonstrated a commitment to this from day one. Also on day one, they mentioned that the multiplayer foundation is already there. I trust them not to botch the game over this.

About Geryk... ever since he gave Star Trek: Away Team a 5.5 when the community gave it a solid 7.5, he's been a non-credible assclown extraordinaire in my book. That particular situation symbolizes what everyone with criticism for the critics feels. The only people that deserved to be strung up into the wind are the Activation executives that sabotaged the game.
on Apr 23, 2006
Forget multiplayer. Concentrate on single player. Add content and features...

Make GC3 a multiplayer game.....

on Apr 23, 2006
I would take new features and perks for Single Player over Multiplayer ...

That being said, if Multiplayer came out, the ONLY mode I would be interested in would be PBEM. Any other form would be useless to me.

Dano
on Apr 23, 2006
Everyone should check out Stellar Frontier right now, you can't call yourself a fan unless you've tried it! It takes getting used too and the manuals don't explain it like it is, but it is certienly exteremly awesome!
on Apr 23, 2006
everyone and their sister does MP now days. this 'theory' that no amount of code can ever match a real player is true but beside the point. for me a good game is about the game itself and how much i enjoy my time spent playinbg it, not about how many 'wins' i can wrack up either against the AI OR against people in a MP setting.

i spent almost 5 years playing Ever Quest so i can understand the thrill of playing a game in real time with/against real people. but some games are better suited for MP than others. and with a limited budget as well as designe constraints. i myself would much rather have a great single player game than to have just another average SP and MP game.
on Apr 24, 2006
Not sure why MP fans are so vocal. To be honest no one I know has ever completed a single MP turn based game. I know folks who get all fired up and they start one and after an hour folks start to drop off and it dies a quick death. Heck I have never even started one and I love TB but who has time? MP is great for fast action games.

Don't waste a single developer on MP until you guys have so much extra cash you just need to throw it away....
on Apr 24, 2006
IMO, the whole reason this topic is so popular is because people love GC2, and they want more of it (afterall, the real multiplayer fanatic would have never bought the game or come here to complain in the first place). It's only natural to want more features from a game you like, and these people just wants to play the game with their friends. I have no problems with that, and if Stardock releases an addon with PBEM, LAN, TCP-IP, and Hot-seat game mode, I think it will be more than enough (although I'll probably never use it).

Having said that, the multiplayer group needs to realize that features that you loved in the game will have to be disabled to make a multiplayer game worth playing. Things like random events, and the ship designer that would so drastically mess up a game has to be disabled or people will start screaming when a turn takes 2 hours, or when their massive empire turns into dust. This is why multiplayer was not part of the released game, because that would conflict with these non-streamlined features.


To be honest, Stardock should have just come out from the start and said, we're making a single player game, and completely dismiss the multiplayer aspect of it (instead of saying things like, our game is cheaper because we didn't include multiplayer - which we can add anytime). Doing so makes it seems like a multiplayer aspect was "missing" from the game and gave people grounds to argue. If you made it clear that the game was designed from the ground up to be a single player game, there would never have been a problem. Afterall, you don't see people complaining about a first person adventure game without multiplayer (or Oblivion even). All you really have to say is that you want to create a game that is able to tell a story. Everyone with any multiplayer experience knows that multiplayer has no story (and any that tries suck at it badly). Galciv2 has that capacity, if only a little more features were implemented... which is why I think more modding support should be much higher in the priority list.
on Apr 24, 2006
the multiplayer group needs to realize that features that you loved in the game will have to be disabled to make a multiplayer game worth playing. Things like random events, and the ship designer that would so drastically mess up a game has to be disabled or people will start screaming when a turn takes 2 hours, or when their massive empire turns into dust.


Exactly! Playing over the internet would take some time, that's why I think that hotseat would rock simply because there are two (or more) people sitting in front of the computer with a couple of drinks, something to eat, and taking turns in kicking the AI's butt! There is no nead to disable the random events and stuff like that, simply because we are both looking at them, and we are both having fun (that's the 90% of my HOMM games, and those 90% are the most fun! )!

Even if we play one against each other, we can play long turns, becouse the other is somewhere near (not looking at the screen, but he is HERE), eating some snacks, perhaps drinking a carbonated soda, if you know what i mean!

I would like to see what I have never seen before in multiplayer! 2vs2 game on 2 computers, one team on one coumputer, other team on second coumputer, that would make my summer "basement LAN" expirience PERFECT!
on Apr 24, 2006
The thing is, Galactic Civilisations 2 has two seperate modes of single-player: sandbox and campaign. When people talk about SP what are they talking about? I suspect they're talking about sandbox.

And here's the thing. How many of the "extras" added between the first and second game do people feel added to the experience? Yes there's a campaign, but it's little more than scenarios tied together by a wafer thin plot. There's nothing to really hold it together. No characters to share empathy with, no personal "ground level" stories to really make you want to win the war. It's just some scenarios put in order of difficulty (ignoring Siege), and how many people found that this added to their enjoyment of sandbox and how many felt that they'd have enjoyed the game more spending their campaign gaming time in the sandbox?

Likewise, the animated movies... why? Beyond the first time, how many watch them? Even the first time, what do they add? They simply seem to exist, but without purpose. They served little to no emotional purpose as nothing really happens in them.

I don't mean to sound harsh, but a lot is made of what went into SP, but it strikes me that much of the stuff added to SP should have been skipped. I'm not one for multiplayer myself, so I'd rather that the money had been spent on more sandbox stuff (like entirely random races) to extend the life of the game.
on Apr 24, 2006
I wouldn't have bought this game if its emphasis was on MP. If you added a simple multiplayer mode and didn't tweak any of the game's other features, I wouldn't care if you added it or not. However, if it will take tons of work, and involve the game changing too much, then I would be against it. It's better to concentrate on SP IMO.
on Apr 24, 2006
Nope,..doesn't need muliplayer.I like multiplayer,...but it is done too much these days and so not having it is welcome.Glad it looks like the idea is losing big time in the poll too.
Rather see more for the single player game,....tactical battles is probably the only huge significant change I'd like to see off hand that i can think of.
If Galactic Civs ever does it,..perhaps in Gal Civs 3 maybe,.do it from the ground up and it will probably work better anyways,..but never do it at a loss of what made the game in the first place.
Best thing you can do is completely ignore the,.everyone else is doing so you should do mainstream way of thinking.After all one the biggest problem with gaming today recognized by real Hardcore Gamers is to much of the same,too often.And that's all we don't need is more "Me Too" games.
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