Had it been Democratically controlled instead, I think we'd probably see a 'little less then half' of Republican voters thinking America not to be a fair and decent country.

Nonsense. Find any evidence to support that. Clinton was President for 8 years. You'd be hard pressed to find Republicans who felt that America wasn't fair or decent.  America is not some transient executive administration.  America is not politicans.  America is the 300 or so million people in it. Our culture. Our principles. The question wasn't "Do you like the current administration" or "Is the US government fair and decent".  The question was as straight forward as you can get - are we a good country?

I think we intend to be a good country, but are represented by people that don't understand what a good country is. Killing 47,000 citizens of another country doesn't make us a good country, it makes us Nazi's. For all of the USA's good intentions the vast majority seem to go hopelessly wrong, especially under this current administration. Anytime this administration gets involved with anything, it tends to degrade, its almost like Bush is cursed, and has cursed this country for his terms. The numbers speak for themselves, consumer confidence is low, household budgets straining under big gas and utility expenses, record levels of murders nationwide, widespread passage of anti-consumer/citizen bills, the list goes on and on.

Are we a good country? No, we aren't. America is filled with arrogance, self centered mentality, a me-first and me-best outlook that generally makes us look like idiots to the rest of the world. America has shown time and time again that they don't value the lives of people of other countries more than themselves. We're an egotistical, wasteful, and ignorant country as a whole.

Nonsense. Find any evidence to support that. Clinton was President for 8 years. - Draginol

Apples and Oranges, Draginol.

Anyway, it's becoming more and more apparent to me you're simply trying to find any excuse to keep the state of things permanent.

The question was pretty straight forward:

Is America a fair and decent country?
- Draginol

I think it's a misnomer to call the somewhat inspecific and highly subjective question 'straightforward'.

For instance, when one uses the word 'America' in this 'straightforward question' are they referring to the Nation as it was founded, the Whole of it's current policies, the polite quality of it's citizens, it's daytime weather, what?

...are we a good country? - Draginol

This was your subjective translation of the straightforward question.

You know, if you ask me if we're a 'good country', I'll tell you that is a decision still being made. We can always do better and I think we've done better before, and I think America is ready to raise the bar and cull the fat. You seem to want to just use the question to somehow prove Democrats hate the U.S. and Republicans love the U.S. no matter what - both stances are divisive and dumb.

Seriously, has somebody else taken over your blogging handle, Draginol?

I think we're going to hell in a handbasket, and I'm not even a dem....

But in comparison to the other countries, I am so glad I'm living in the Good Ol' US of A. I wouldn't have it any other way.

DrMiller: If someone asks 5 people "Is DRMiller a fair and decent guy" and 2 people say yes, 1 person says no, and 1 person says "I'm not sure" are you going to suggest that most people think you're fair and decent? No. Someone saying "I'm not sure" is not a ringing endorsement. What would be your opinion of someone who said "I'm not sure" to the question of whether you're a fair and decent person? For me, I have no second-thoughts - the United States is a fair and decent country. I think the world would be much better off if more countries were like the United States (another question that was asked incidentally in that poll). That doesn't mean I like every US policy or whatever, it has nothing to do with that. The question is whether we're fair and decent.

I was "not" refuting your assesment the majority of Kerry voters do not think America is fair and decent. What I am saying is that the "other" portion which disagree with the 46% are not being mentioned at all. And in all fairness the difference between the two is what 2 or 3 people? It can't be many.

What binaristic vision you have Draginol. It would seem by many of your posts that reality for you is either defined in terms of being a republican or a democrat. and if one is not one.. then one must be the other. And if one thinks that America is not a 'fair and decent' place to live this somehow automatically equates with 'hating - or at least not liking very much' America.

For myself and my friends life is, and people are, far too complex to support such simplistic reasoning. Such syllogistic thinking would, however, seem to characterise much of your discourse. Perhaps your inability to experience let alone acknowledge that complexity is a reflection of the rigidity of your own moral universe. The wonderful thing about America is that we are free to express our dissent in practical concrete terms, no?

Consider this. how many potential repeaters let alone purchasers of your software do you think you have alienated with your simplistic 'us & them' characterizations?

What binaristic vision you have Draginol. - Mr. Roberts

I've accused another blogger here of the same thing. It may be a tactic used to polarize people and get them to choose sides however, and may not be indicative of one's actual reasoning.

On a similar note, the use of O'Reilly-esque lines of questioning (yes or no) like that being used in the Rasmussen poll are objectively designed to serve purposes other then open discussion of topics.

If consistency is the hobgoblin of small minds then Deference.. then the least one can accuse Draginol of is a lack of consistency in his approach.

Though I am critical of Draginol's assertions, I'm not trying to personally attack him or accuse him of being small minded.

If you're saying what I think you are, you should provide some links to prove your point and hopefully it has something to do with the topic of the thread.

I am referring to this thread Deference. I think it speaks for itself, don't you?

Draginol's history of posting at JU is quite extensive.

He's written 1095 articles here at JU. I think declaring him to be small minded simply because of this one thread is premature.

As I sincerely questioned before:

Seriously, has somebody else taken over your blogging handle, Draginol? - Def. Post #18

so lemme get this straight: unless one is able to make oneself see wonderful new clothing where there is none, one hates (or at least don't much like) the naked emperor?

I don't know if that analogy is quite fitting (ooh, bad pun!) Kingbee.

It simply seems to me, Mr. Roberts, that you are leaping on an opportunity to smack Draginol as opposed to attacking his argument(s).

I think we intend to be a good country, but are represented by people that don't understand what a good country is. Killing 47,000 citizens of another country doesn't make us a good country, it makes us Nazi's. For all of the USA's good intentions the vast majority seem to go hopelessly wrong, especially under this current administration. Anytime this administration gets involved with anything, it tends to degrade, its almost like Bush is cursed, and has cursed this country for his terms. The numbers speak for themselves, consumer confidence is low, household budgets straining under big gas and utility expenses, record levels of murders nationwide, widespread passage of anti-consumer/citizen bills, the list goes on and on.

So civilian deaths in a war determines whether someone is a Nazi or not?  We killed over a million Japanese civilians in World War II.  Were we Nazis then too?  And in World War II, were were somewhat targeting civilians.  In Iraq, we were trying to keep civilian deaths to a low (and don't let this statement indicate that I agree with your premise that 40,000+ civilians died from US military weapons in Iraq).

Are we a good country? No, we aren't. America is filled with arrogance, self centered mentality, a me-first and me-best outlook that generally makes us look like idiots to the rest of the world.

Let me guess, you're a Democrat. 

So which country should we emulate? Which country isn't filled with arrogance or self-centered mentality?

I see the United States filled with compassionate, charitable people. Americans are amongst the most charitable people on Earth. We have spilled more blood than any other country to liberate other countries from tyranny. 

America has shown time and time again that they don't value the lives of people of other countries more than themselves. We're an egotistical, wasteful, and ignorant country as a whole.

Spoken like a true Democrat. Thank you for making my case.

You know, if you ask me if we're a 'good country', I'll tell you that is a decision still being made. We can always do better and I think we've done better before, and I think America is ready to raise the bar and cull the fat. You seem to want to just use the question to somehow prove Democrats hate the U.S. and Republicans love the U.S. no matter what - both stances are divisive and dumb. Seriously, has somebody else taken over your blogging handle, Draginol?

The decision is still being made? That's a total cop-out.

Read Sue's response, is she blaming the administration? No. She thinks on the whole we're a bunch of self-centered horrible people.  What some of you don't want to accept is that there is a wide swath of people on the left who think America (not the administration but the PEOPLE -- our culture, our way of life, our basic principles) are contemptible.