Brad Wardell's views about technology, politics, religion, world affairs, and all sorts of politically incorrect topics.
Published on September 30, 2008 By Draginol In Demigod Journals

This week we intend to release the first update to the Demigod engine test beta (beta 1-A).  Under the hood there have been tons of changes made and we're beginning to make room for some of the more significant changes you'll be seeing in Beta 2 (beginning of November).

Here are some of the highlights:

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My friend Soren Johnson has a great article entitled "the seven deadly sins of strategy games".  The bottom line is to paraphrase Sid Meijer, good strategy games give players "interesting" choices.

The flags in Demigod are going to be core element to this because controlling these flags are how the different sides will gain tremendous advantages. 

A good player (or team) would be able to quickly eliminate a new player or team simply by taking these flags and holding them long enough to overwhelm the enemy.  This prevents the problem in many multiplayer games where even when you're playing against unskilled players, you're still committing a lot of time to the game. Yet, at the same time, the game mechanic is straight forward enough that it's intuitive to players why they're winning or losing.

The team is brain storming all kinds of different types of flags. For beta 1-A, we just did gold as a proof of concept.

 

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This next change is going to be more controversial without some explanation.   When someone posts about this saying how they hate this change, point them to this post.  The idea is that we're starting to make room in the UI and in the balancing for lots of additional skills as well as skill buffing  (where you enhance one of the existing skills with a modifier).  So don't take this screen as implying that we're going to have some dull linear progression.

 

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The second map is in.  The mine map is somewhat smaller but has some interesting strategic conundrums.

So when will the beta be out? We are targeting this Thursday (basically we release betas on Thursdays typically).


Comments (Page 4)
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on Oct 01, 2008

lprometheus
For all you flag lock haters this is not broken. If I spend the cash up front to lock the flag then I gave up on items like boots, health and scrolls so I can control that flag for 5min how is this broke you took another path and could have stop me but you did not you were off leveling up so this is strategy. However I would like to see an unlock flag or key but not at the same cost if I send 500 as forethought you should have to spend 750 as an after thought.

Now you are talking my lingo this is strategy and it should cost you more like lprometheus states to unlock my strategy. This lock is not broken but I can see adding a strategy to reverse someone's but at a cost. Because while I was standing around and waiting on a flag you bought boots and armour and got two levels creep farming. Each of us made a choice a strategic choice if you know mine will win the game then fight me for it.

on Oct 01, 2008

I think maybe after a lock is finished you should have to wait 30 seconds before it can be locked again. That way someone can/has to go back and defend it for a little while and the other team still has a chance to win it back.

on Oct 01, 2008

 

ToxDrawace
I think maybe after a lock is finished you should have to wait 30 seconds before it can be locked again. That way someone can/has to go back and defend it for a little while and the other team still has a chance to win it back.

30 seconds is too short. It's not hard to defend a flag for 30 seconds if your team knows what you are doing. 30 seconds is barely enough to walk from the base to the flag, and then convert the flag. Currently there is absolutely no visual information to the other team for how long a flag is remained to be locked, and when it is unlocked.

 

 

I'd say flags have topological links, that you can only commit locks on a flag that is a higher hierarchy, e.g. flags at your base; not ones with a lower hierarchy, e.g. ones at central strategic point. A visual indication of a number representing flag level is shown. 0 being the lowest and not lockable, usually placed at front lines. Once the opposite team captures that flag, then subsquent flags all have their 'level' decreased by 1. Now you can no longer lock a flag of higher hierarchy (e.g. in your base), until you recapture the flag at the centre. If a team did not lock the flag at their base, they are capturable no matter what status the central flag is in for example.

Now this way there's no hardship of flag locking, as it is by mean only protects suprise raids against your flag(s) at home, for example (higher hierarchy), and you can't lock a flag that is exposed (lower hierarchy). By capturing that flag, you have access to the enemy higer hierarchy flag(s) since they can't lock it anymore.

Of course flags need visual indications of whether they are locked to the enemy team, so that when an enemy sneaks into your base, they know whether your higher hierarchy flag(s) is/are locked. Balance is made to the cost of the flag locks so that it's not impossible to lock most flags, but highly undesirable.

on Oct 01, 2008

I hope this has the fix to add pixel shader 2.0 support.  This will then run on my laptop even if it's a bit slow and looks crappy.

on Oct 01, 2008

The flags in Demigod are going to be core element to this because controlling these flags are how the different sides will gain tremendous advantages

Lock!!!!!

on Oct 01, 2008

@AnnihilatorX

I kinda just used 30 secs as an example, but yeah, that probably is a bit short, isn't it

I like your idea a lot. It kind of reminds me of Team Fortress 2.

A modification to your idea was maybe locks are less effective for lower hierarchy flags. Maybe they lock for less time or maybe they just make it harder for the other team to bring it to their side instead of impossible.

on Oct 01, 2008

Maybe instead of flag locks, you could do a Flag Guardian creep, and therefore the flag would be as secure as you paid for it to be?  You could buy more Guardians depending on how much you felt the flag needed, and wether you wanted a group that could handle enemies trying to take it, or just slow them down so you can come back and deal with the problem yourself.

Then again, I'm not even a beta player - the idea just popped into my head.

on Oct 01, 2008

Iceciro thats a good idea imo but i doubt it will be impleneted because it would meen they would have to compeltey change the feature and they generally dont do that - but if they do thats great.

Annihilator I like your idea of how you shouldnt be able to lock more important flags like the ones at your base (or they should be made harder to lock) and vice versa with the middel flag.

Horseradish there is MINIMUM strategy involved in buying lock scrolls because it rewards the player A LOT (especially late game where whoever has middle flag generally wins) for only 500. How is it far that the opponent can constantly have your flags locked for the whole game? There is NO skill in that and it needs to be balanced. I dont understand your arguement of "stop complaining its strategy". Is stun locking permanetly with 3 rooks strategy? Sure it is, but its fucking stupid strategy that requires no skill. You support 3 rooks stun locking with boulders?

on Oct 01, 2008

Friends and I could play against you guys and make you all of a sudden change your mind and hate how the flag lock item lock works but it's not worth my effort

I know for a fact that most people that say it's fine don't really know how to play the game.  And i'm leaving it at that.
I'm tired of trying to explain why it's broken to people that don't know how to play the game.  But you just wait until you play against someone who knows how to ABUSE the flag locking and then you'll be crying about it and changing your tune.

I don't get beaten by the flag locking.  I know how to abuse it too well.  But I like a game that's fair.

on Oct 01, 2008

-Ness Monster!!!!

 

Flags FTW! not able to lock so some time seems reasonable...

on Oct 02, 2008

what time will it be out exactly?

on Oct 02, 2008

It might not even be released on thursdasy for sure so lets just hope for that.

I think it will be released like late GMT time....

on Oct 02, 2008

Perhaps it would be best to not have any single flag be quite as powerful as the center flag in the waterfall stage is, so it being locked away isn't as big of a deal.  If there were 3 flags, locking one of them wouldn't be quite as decisive of an advantage, I think.

on Oct 02, 2008

I got an idea for the flags-

Why not instead of locking the flag, put sort of a defensive structure on it that need to be destroyed before capturing it. (like Compeny of heroes had) in higher level items it can also have retaliation or something.

on Oct 02, 2008

Just make the flag-lock item more expensive. No need to gut the thing.

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