Brad Wardell's views about technology, politics, religion, world affairs, and all sorts of politically incorrect topics.
Tips for community owners for dealing with net thugs
Published on May 7, 2005 By Draginol In Living in Cyberspace

Every once in awhile you'll hear about a beloved website whose host has taken it down out of frustration with having to deal with Internet thugs. Internet thugs are, thankfully, not very common, but there are enough out there that they can wreck the experience in trying to admin a website.

So what is an Internet thug? An Internet thug is basically a "griefer". Someone who gets off on trying to anger and upset other people. They do this in a variety of ways and the most common way is to take advantages of loopholes or gaps in a website's forum system.

For example, when we designed the blog community JoeUser.com, we allow users to "blacklist" people. So if someone is causing them anguish, they can make them go away.  Now, the person can still try (with a different IP address) to come back as an anonymous user but the user can then make their blogs require a UserID to post and at that point, the griefer is usually stopped in their tracks.

But many sites don't have that level of protection. Some news systems only support anonymous commenting or no commenting at all (at which case, much of the enjoyment is taken away if no one can even interact).  On such sites, the thugs can go wild.

Other sites have more protections but "moderators", wizops, and other sub-administrators don't have complete access to them. That can enable a thug to target a particular moderator to try to get rid of them. And most volunteers have a lower threshold of pain before they'll quit.

For me, when faced with a "flight or fight" instinct I am inclined to go with the latter.  I've been running on-line communities for twenty years (literally, 1985 with Commodore 64 based BBSes on up).  I've seen these guys and they typically are serial griefers -- they get off on it so they keep doing it over and over again.  I've found that the only way to deal with them is use all the admin powers at my disposal to make it painful for them as well.  Most admins I've met tend not to want to play dirty or take the gloves off. The griefers count on that and hence can play their sadistic little games with impunity.

But like I said, I play rough. If someone's griefing me, I'll get nasty.  Instead of just removing their post, I'll edit their post.  And if that doesn't discourage them, I'll eventually start posting their IP address.  And if that doesn't work, there is a lot more uglier stuff (particularly if the griefer doesn't live in the US) that I can do.  But usually post editing is enough. 

For example, if a griefer writes: "You're a pathetic asshat, (user's real name when possible) . You should stick with having sex with your (insert relative) ."  I will change it to say (with their real name as the responder) "I wish I was a girl. Sometimes, when no one is around, I like to wear a dress. Not having any genitalia makes me confused sometimes about what I should do and that's why I act out. Can you forgive me?"

Your ability to deal with griefers is only limited by your own conscience, your affiliation with the site (if you're a moderator and not an admin, you should be talking to the site owner before you start wreaking havoc, the site owner might be better equipped to deal with the griefer), and of course your real world resources.  In my case, we have lots of lawyers so any would-be blow hard making legal threats can learn the hard way just how nasty the US legal system can be, especially to someone skirting the boundaries of cyber-terrorism.  Which also means you should keep a log of any posts that person has made for use as future evidence if necessary.

Griefers rarely get bored. They get off on trying to hurt other people. But they're usually stupid, lazy people who will take the path of least resistance. The best way to deal with them in my opinion is through discouragment. There's lots of potential targets for these losers, your best bet is to make yourself a less appealing target. And I do that by playing hardball with them.  It's not about revenge or getting them back or even justice.  It's purely about finding the lever that makes them go away when a simple ban just doesn't stick.


Comments (Page 4)
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on May 10, 2005
Well you can quote someone else saying those words if it is in context to the discussion at hand. Moderator discretion of course..
on May 10, 2005
On The Bright Side, I Can Now Say "Fuck" Or "Assclown" From Time To Time Without
Being Censored. Unless Of Course The Rule Above Is Applied


Actually - I asked Jafo earlier if cussing from time to time is now allowed. He said no. I'm still confused about the meaning of this thread.
on May 10, 2005

It is all about context.

The 'F' word was used in this thread for a reason.  It was a quoted example.

That doesn't mean automatically that it's open season on 'kiddie-speak'.

Generally "the 'F' word" is used by people who either think it's..

A... kewl and leet and 'all growed up'

B... they haven't reached second grade English classes yet so that's their sum-total of English Expression.

or

C... they want to attack someone or something as vehemently as possible and are short on ascerbic vitriol.

A and B are just plain sad...and C is frowned upon, anyway.

So, there's not too many ways its use is really justified...

on May 10, 2005
That doesn't mean automatically that it's open season on 'kiddie-speak'.


Glad you're not a teacher.

Well Double Zero, Don't Know What To Tell You. You Can, You Can't. If It's quoting Someone Else Yes - If Not No. You Can Say "Fuck" In PG13 Rated Movies And This Is A
PG13 Site So Umm Yes? Just Do What Feels Natural and If It's Not Acceptable, One Of
The Forum Admins Will Edit It Up. You Might Even Get A Long Boring and Useless Dialouge With a Wink At the End. If You're Lucky ...
on May 10, 2005
Well..Thanks WoW, Draginol and Jafo...Im pretty clear on it now..LoL

I'll just keep following my own "rule of thumb" Just dont do it..

Then..there isnt any confusion..::laughs::

If others do it..thats their own problem..and the admins..and I suppose the few that complain about those that do it..

either way.
it's all good,
Zero.
on May 10, 2005
Oh come on people. We're up to 52 (not counting this as I type) comments.

Surely there's some more of y'all out that have been in the same situation and had to deal with thugs.

I really expected, and have been waiting, to read some "Griefers? Let me tell you about some griefers".

Let's hear some more snippets - flesh this puppy out.
on May 10, 2005
system hash marks,


That reminds me, I've seen this term before - being somewhat quasisemiputerilliterate...

What does it mean?
on May 10, 2005
Oh yeah, had another question/

Since things really don't change every generation has it's own version, I was wondering...

Would these thugs be akin to those who always showed up and 'protested' (basically shouting inane things that have no bearing) anybody who was speaking anywhere. Not the true beleivers, the fringe crowd. Or, would they equate more to those really weird homeless looking ones who just rant/rave and cuss out anyone and everyone?
on May 11, 2005

(basically shouting inane things that have no bearing)

You mean 'hecklers' .... yep, these are them critters ...

on May 11, 2005
Okay, now I get it.
Thanks Admin Jafo.

Still wondering about hash marks and having to replace a HD.
on May 11, 2005
Bichur: repeat after me. "I am Sofa King. We, Todd Ed!"

Repeat as often as necessary.
on May 11, 2005
Hey
Bakerstreet... look out your window. Short bus is there to take you to spelling class.

I do have to admit though, with no intention of making fun of anyone, that's the first time I've seen a speech impediment carry over to typing.
on May 11, 2005
Bichur: repeat after me. "I am Sofa King. We, Todd Ed!"


And by the way, I'm sorry but I don't really want to join your little circle.
You'll have to be content with Bakerstree, Todd, Ed.
on May 11, 2005
And yet when someone doesn't agree with Brad, and refuses to get the point that "others" think he should, he gets banned. Go figure... Refusing to agree to a groups point and steadfast sticking to your guns, gets less respect than dealing with an Asshat. Looks like I'm working on strike two. Also BTW nice touch, "pimping your Post to "adwords" or whatever they call those advertisements. How can I insert them into my post for revenues?
on May 11, 2005
I've never seen Brad ban anyone for disagreement with him. Just for acting like an asshat about it.
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